Ok, dude, you've got my blood up now...
Seriously ;) while I can see your point, Korga, I have to respectfully disagree with most of what you've said. No name calling (honest!), and I certainly won't slag off your spelling! About 90% of board posters on any board make regular errors, and being an occasional proofreader, it really jumps out, so I just learn to grin and bear it :) I'm sorry AllenS, but you were a little out of order! ;)
Before I start, I should point out that I like Enterprise, much more than I liked Voyager. While there have been what I see as continuity errors (I can be just as irritated by this) I've learnt to put up with it. There's much about the show that commends itself to me, and it's a personal opinion, yes, but I find it to be much more "Trek" than DS9 (which I loved). Trek to me is about exploration, standing alone against the unknown, overcoming obstacles in the most optimistic manner possible and races co-operating to meet those goals. Enterprise has stuck pretty close to this.
First of all, I have to agree with Ineti and a couple of the others - if you don't like Enterprise, ignore it. Don't watch it, and don't use it in your game. Just because something is mentioned in the book doesn't mean you have to use it - it's your game, after all!
Whether Enterprise can be considered canon or not is an issue for the show's producers (I believe their position is "if it was on the screen as live action, it's canon, otherwise it ain't"). Unfortunately, we can only decide what we want to use. In my case, I rewrote ST5 and Voyager substantially, and I ignore various elements of episodes I don't like. I also pretty much ignore anything from novels, tech manuals, fan sites and games - UNLESS I like it.
You say Roddenberry would have dropped Enterprise at the first error, I have to disagree. I honestly don't think that when Roddenberry first created Trek, he expected it to last as long and become as popular as it did - there are enough continuity clashes in TOS alone to render the whole thing untenable if you take every word as literal.
Your list of "continuity errors" is interesting... I shall quote before commenting if you don't mind:
"The meeting of Klingons was is space...not earth" - I'd like to know your source on this. All we know about the first meeting is that it was not a good one and led to a century of war (Picard). I don't believe it's ever been stated on screen when or where this was. And while "Broken Bow" may seem to violate the bad meeting concept, later episodes seem to indicate that the Klingons certainly didn't appreciate it (I think this is due to Klingon concepts of honour, I commented extensively on this elsewhere).
"why in Gods Green Earth would Christopher Pike use Lasers in the "Cage" when they had the "Phase Pistol" " - interesting question. My argument would be that the term laser was only used in "the Cage" and that it is easier to consider that episode in error (it's one episode, and a lot of other elements were changed before TOS began for real). I can't remember who here suggested it, but another idea is that the phase pistol was produced before practical hand-held lasers, and that those were more effective when they first appeared a couple of decades later. Later phasers may be based in the "phase pistol principle."
"I dont know about you but wasnt the first long range Explorer ship the SS Valiant?....." - sorry but that's definitely never been stated. IIRC, the Valiant was the first ship to reach the galactic barrier, so it was just the furthest out. It may have been one of the first... (Oh, Evan - there are two Valiants - you're thinking of the Defiant-class USS Valiant ;) )
"But I ask you now has TNG, DS-9 or Voyager ever gone to the exstent of this much change without explaining it? I think not." - hmm, not sure off the top of my head about TNG and DS9, but Voyager completely rewrote first contact with the Borg. It was established (TNG) that the Enterprise D made first contact in 2365, with the next contact not happening until 2367. In Voyager, 7 of 9 was the daughter of scientists who had been researching the Borg at close range for some time. Anneka Hansen was about 6 at the time of assimilation, 7 is obviously in her late twenties and Voyager first meets her in 2375 - I'm sure you can do the maths! There's also the small matter of the Eugenics War which devastated a large chunk of Earth in 1996 - I didn't see much evidence of it in "Future Tense." These are changes far greater than Enterprise has managed yet...
"same applies to all Startrek materials and if Roddenberry's approval isnt on it ... it should be scrapped." - err, neither DS9 nor Voyager had Roddenberry's approval. ISTR DS9 didn't get the go ahead until after he was out of the hot seat.
My point is, really, that's just entertainment. If you don't like something for your game, change it! After all, nothing you create is canon either! ;)
Re: Ok, dude, you've got my blood up now...
Quote:
Originally posted by Imagus
Before I start, I should point out that I like Enterprise, much more than I liked Voyager. While there have been what I see as continuity errors (I can be just as irritated by this) I've learnt to put up with it. There's much about the show that commends itself to me, and it's a personal opinion, yes, but I find it to be much more "Trek" than DS9 (which I loved). Trek to me is about exploration, standing alone against the unknown, overcoming obstacles in the most optimistic manner possible and races co-operating to meet those goals. Enterprise has stuck pretty close to this.
later. Later phasers may be based in the "phase pistol principle."
"I dont know about you but wasnt the first long range Explorer ship the SS Valiant?....." - sorry but that's definitely never been stated. IIRC, the Valiant was the first ship to reach the galactic barrier, so it was just the furthest out. It may have been one of the first... (Oh, Evan - there are two Valiants - you're thinking of the Defiant-class USS Valiant ;) )
"
that's a great description ( far more accurate than mine ) what in my eyes is trek. Union among the people and exploration.
Concerning the phaser thing. There is the episode where the Cage is included into an ordinary episode of TOS with Kirk and all ( Do not know the English title, the German one is translated: Spock at court ). how do they call the 'ph/laser' in that episode in the 'old' scenes?
Oh and of course I just mistyped the date I meant 2069. There is something about it on startrek.com, even a picture.
and to correct my self, those who do not like Enterprise, gol boldy where no man has gone before, either - its just another way ;)
we see DS9 in "Ro Laren"?!
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh really?
I make fun of Enterprise too
this is the same schlock that was given as the Motionless Voyager
"It's Star Trek LUV it!"
ewwwwww i can't do that
i cant do that with the tos movies either
scotty, uhura, pavel, sulua and mccoy where just cardboard characters
so much could have been done with that series
same with enterprise
give me the Daedulus CLASS
