Do we even need Decipher anymore?

Well, I just got an e-mail from an e-store that's very good about letting me know about pre-orders and here's what he had to say about my ST pre-orders,

"At this point, Decipher has made no plans for release of any further Star Trek or Lord of the Rings RPG products. Every projected release date has been missed, and we can not get any answers as to when, or if, these products will ever be released.



You have an open pre-order for one of these products. We are canceling all pre-orders until a release date and pricing information is confirmed. Once we have confirmation, we will email everyone who placed an order for the product and give you a chance to re-order.



I am sorry that we have not been able to provide you with more information. We have been kept in the dark as well."

I hope this isn't the end and they don't go out like a whimper in the night but in a blaze of glory! Please Decipher say it isn't so!

7 of 11
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:(

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Originally posted by GenesisWeapon
..., acquire the Trek license, ...

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:eek:

Okay, you take care of that and I'll pay the drinks. :rolleyes:

Seriously, how do you think we could get that much money. Besides, as long as we don't charge anything for our products, there is no need to purchase the license. Though Paramount might see things a little bit different.
Do you think there is any possibility of Decipher relinquishing their rights on the CODA system, assuming they don't sell them together with their Trek and LOTR RPG rights?
Which brings up another question? How similar can two RPG systems be before anyone can sue the other party for copyright violation? After all, just about any possible dice mechanic has been used before.

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Originally posted by 7 of 11
Well, I just got an e-mail from an e-store that's very good about letting me know about pre-orders...

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It sounds like your e-store is more on the ball with regard to customer support than Decipher would ever dream of being, 7...if we'd been given even that much information on what the current standing is, we wouldn't be in the conundrum we are today. Doug continues to do his best for us, but he's fettered by an administration/management that, as far as we can tell, has simply given up.

With regard to going out with bangs-not-whimpers, the handwriting's been on the wall for quite a while. As Don indicated some time ago, every day that Decipher doesn't release - or at least announce a solid date for the release - of their works makes it that much more unlikely that we'll ever see them at all.

The ex-LUG/Decipher writers and designers have stated it; Decipher's subsequent press-releases on this year's plans have confirmed it; it was true then, and it's true now: Decipher doesn't care. They're not doing this out of animosity, pique, revenge or even the sadistic pleasure of pulling the wings off flies. They just don't care. This isn't necessarily a worst-case scenario - as Cigarman wrote when he started this thread, the ball's in our court, we have the technology, and the will. What remains is for us to get our butts organized and see if we can become professional enough to take on a task and see it through to completion. :)

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Originally posted by D.S.McBride
What remains is for us to get our butts organized and see if we can become professional enough to take on a task and see it through to completion. :)

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That's it, really. I don't think Decipher or any other company is ever going to release anything with the Coda system ever again. It falls to the fans to keep the system and games alive.

This product line is cursed.

Hi,

The most positive attitude that I know of is action. :D

So what if we just create a list of all netbooks available with links to support fan created books? A sticky just like the erratas to give so publicity to the authors.

It may be because I'm a newbie here, but I had difficulties to find a link to Killerwhalle's ESO... But with a master list it would be easy to find a book or announce a new netbook. I can help to create it... Just an idea.

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Originally posted by D.S.McBride
It sounds like your e-store is more on the ball with regard to customer support than Decipher would ever dream of being, 7...if we'd been given even that much information on what the current standing is, we wouldn't be in the conundrum we are today. Doug continues to do his best for us, but he's fettered by an administration/management that, as far as we can tell, has simply given up.

With regard to going out with bangs-not-whimpers, the handwriting's been on the wall for quite a while. As Don indicated some time ago, every day that Decipher doesn't release - or at least announce a solid date for the release - of their works makes it that much more unlikely that we'll ever see them at all.

The ex-LUG/Decipher writers and designers have stated it; Decipher's subsequent press-releases on this year's plans have confirmed it; it was true then, and it's true now: Decipher doesn't care. They're not doing this out of animosity, pique, revenge or even the sadistic pleasure of pulling the wings off flies. They just don't care. This isn't necessarily a worst-case scenario - as Cigarman wrote when he started this thread, the ball's in our court, we have the technology, and the will. What remains is for us to get our butts organized and see if we can become professional enough to take on a task and see it through to completion. :)

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I guess if they won't talk to the people who WANT to sell the products to the people who WANT to buy them then *sigh* all is lost? I like the high energy ideas being trhown around here and I wonder who will catch it and run with it? There's a wealth of talent here, and I won't be surprised if this site runs with it. Once again if you've seen KillerWhale's ESO then nuff said. We can do it.

7 of 11
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:p

Yea, we can do it -- we also can't charge for it.

I love Star Trek as much (if not more) than the next guy. The reality is though, I can only write so many words free of charge. The prospect of writing and publishing material, free of charge, only goes so far. Then we start running into the QA level of it all with no one really in charge.

Plus (there's more?) you still have to keep it all somewhat underneath the radar; remember this is someone else's intellectual property (Viacom). It is by their grace that sites like this are allowed to exist at all. The next company to get the Trek license might not like having free competition. (Remember what happened with LUG and the original LUGTrek Netbook?)

Acquire the Trek license? Okay, whose got mid- to high-five figures burning a hole in their pocket at the moment and a lawyer to negotiate the contract? Sure, I'd sell my car and give it a try but I don't want to run a publishing company. :)

Now, before anyone accuses me of being a downer and a kill-joy, I'm just bringing these topics up. Sometimes, in our enthusiasm, these issues are glossed over or ignored. There are some very really legal restrictions when dealing with someone else's intellectual property. I'm not saying these issues can't be overcome (this site has been running since 1998ish) but you need to be aware of them. That's why I'd be excited to keep this site running, do something to help defray the costs, and provide some outlet to "publish" these materials.

For my part, I need to see what happens with Decipher and the Trek license first; their decision will likely impact my own. Plus I'm still having conversations with them. (Well, trying at least.) :)

The waiting is the hard part. I just wish they could come back with an answer. Kinda like with bandage over a week-old wound, just get it over with quickly even though there will be initial pain.

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Originally posted by Don Mappin
I love Star Trek as much (if not more) than the next guy. The reality is though, I can only write so many words free of charge. The prospect of writing and publishing material, free of charge, only goes so far. Then we start running into the QA level of it all with no one really in charge.
Plus (there's more?) you still have to keep it all somewhat underneath the radar; remember this is someone else's intellectual property (Viacom). It is by their grace that sites like this are allowed to exist at all. The next company to get the Trek license might not like having free competition. (Remember what happened with LUG and the original LUGTrek Netbook?)

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Words of wisdom from someone who's been there (and still is, in the sense that he's carrying on a conversation with those Decipherian spirits in the Bajoran Wormhole :) )

As my sensei told us many times - and I tell my own students now - "Better to restrain the raging tiger than awaken the sleeping ox." I'd rather see too much enthusiasm than too little for both this site and these incipient projects, but at the same time we have to always keep in mind that, ultimately, we're playing in someone else's sandbox here. Also, the enegy petering out and the attrition factor setting in once the realization that - by golly - this is real work when you get down to it, has to be accounted for.

This, for me, is where the issue of the professionalism gets brought in. The love is there to get you over the rough spots, both in romance and business. The professionalism gives you the machinery to make sure that those spots are smoothed over effectively and without causing more problems than are solved.

Have I got some spare time on my hands currently? Yes. Would I be willing to set up/run/participate in some Icon - and Coda, yeah, there, I said it - projects that catch my fancy? Yes again. Does it really matter if I get paid or not? It'd be damned nice, that's for sure, but it wouldn't be the first time I've done it for free either. But all of the real-world issues are going to be have to be dealt with, step-by-step and in boring old bureaucratic fashion, before we can touch the stars.

I'm putting my name in. I'm willing to make the leap of faith and support the cause - writing, layout, art, what have you. But let's make sure that what we're doing is, a) legal, and b) going to get finished in pretty much the same way it got started, before we start getting all hot and bothered. :)

I received the same email yesterday as well. I hope Decipher will eventually appease us. You would think that they would have said something by now.

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Originally posted by jeffearley
I received the same email yesterday as well. I hope Decipher will eventually appease us. You would think that they would have said something by now.

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After the previous two years' experiences? No, actually, I wouldn't be inclined to think that at all.

Hey, guys, just something to think about.

One of the RPGs I used to play back in the day a lot was the classic Marvel Super Heroes RPG from (then TSR) WotC. Much like Trek, Marvel's had a rough go of it in game licensing, as every subsequent attempt to do a Marvel game gets aborted after shorter and shorter a shelf-life.

Here's my point though:

At present, you can download practically all the core rulebooks for classic MSH off the web. For free.

Not only that, but there was an (unfortunately aborted due to lack of interest) attempt to develop a new edition of the game for free download.

I guess what I'm saying here is, given that the license holder ceases to mind, doing something along the lines of what everyone's postulating is possible to some extent.

Of course, the larger issues that Don and D.S. have brought up are still paramount, but I just thought I'd throw that out for everyone.

--mac

Just a quick note; slightly off-topic, but close enough to scrape by.

Don: I decided to check your Abulia Savant site today and noticed that you mentioned discussions with the Decipher upper-echelon on e-publishing the ENT work you'd done for them. Does this form of release apply to the rest of the queued works as well?

I recall that pretty much this same discussion was held with Wizards back in Sept. '00, after Decipher:rolleyes: had picked up the licence. While that proposal, obviously, was not followed through on (God knows why), does it look as though there's been any progress on this end? E-publication, quite honestly, seems to be the best possible solution for all involved at this point: it gets the work out there at - as you stated - minimal cost; they can charge a fee per book that would keep them in the black; and it shuts the ravening horde of consumers up and lets Decipher close the door on this matter forever.

I went to ADB's "Prime Directive" rpg :)

they have already come out with "Empire of Steel"

i.e. The Klingons

next up..The Romulans

see www.starfleetgames.com

:cool: