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Theoretically a Fleet Admiral should be a 5 star admiral right? Or are they a fleet adm in name only and as such head up a whole fleet worth of ships, maybe even multiple sectors worth.
For the sake of nothing else I'd make a Fleet Captain a 5 pip rank. And a Commordore a 1 star Admiral.
But thats just me http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/smile.gif
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SIRSIG :D
AKA: SirPostalot
AKA: The MapMaker
AKA: The Trek Cartographer
AKA:...Well I could keep going forever ;)
Actually, for Fleet Captain I use the rank insignia that Director Sloan used when he first appeared on DS9 under the guise of an investigative officer looking for traitors on the station - a Captain's four pips with a bar beneath them.
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Hmmm, Interesting.Quote:
Originally posted by Owen E Oulton:
Actually, for Fleet Captain I use the rank insignia that Director Sloan used when he first appeared on DS9 under the guise of an investigative officer looking for traitors on the station - a Captain's four pips with a bar beneath them.
I might have to track down a screen capture from this episode which ironically was on tv the other night and I was to tired to watch it. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/smile.gif
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SIRSIG :D
AKA: SirPostalot
AKA: The MapMaker
AKA: The Trek Cartographer
AKA:...Well I could keep going forever ;)
I always thought that the 'under bar' was ment to signify their status as Sec31 members, not to mention those uniforms. Do not in that episode, the two LT's in the shot also had the 'under bar'. Thus this means that the 'under bar' isn't specific to CAPT Sloan.
Therefore I would be careful if, inside game, or outside for that matter, if you meet an officer with a little gold line/bar underneath their pips. Don't start running, or they might get suspiciuos and come after you.
Remember that the 'under bar' was only used when he was masquarading as Internal Affairs, when they went into the Leather S31 uniforms, there was no insignia at all...
Owen, I see your point, the insignia does work that way weel, Now I have to choose whether I like the fleet captain or my original opinion of an Intellgence officer rank...
Of course in my idea, it puts IA into Starfleet Intelligence...
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Dan.
"A couple of thoughts from a random mind!"
[This message has been edited by Dan Gurden (edited 05-17-2001).]
In naval history (U.S) a Fleet Admiral is a five star. . .the stars aranged in the form of a pentagon. The rank has not been used in the U.S since World War Two; when there were four of them (I might be mistaken on the number). (As a side note. . .some navies call there five stars, as in Germany, Grand Admiral.)Quote:
Originally posted by SIR SIG:
Theoretically a Fleet Admiral should be a 5 star admiral right? Or are they a fleet adm in name only and as such head up a whole fleet worth of ships, maybe even multiple sectors worth.
For the sake of nothing else I'd make a Fleet Captain a 5 pip rank. And a Commordore a 1 star Admiral.
But thats just me http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/smile.gif
Calguard, true. I should have been more precise. To clarify:Quote:
Originally posted by calguard66:
In the US military all Warrant Officers are technically "commissioned" when they are promoted to WO2... it is for certain UCMJ reasons and other legalities.
Warrant officers are not comissioned. Chief Warrant Officers ARE comissioned.
This is basically what it all boils down to from a 12 year veteran in the greatest Navy in the whole worls. Enlisted are specialist they are there to learn one specific job and to become subject matter experts. Officers are generalist they learn a little bit about everything taught to them by senior enlisted personnel, JO (Junoir Officer) should do well if they are liked and respected by enlisted people, Officers careers can be made of broke by enlisted personel. Yes we can severly screw an officers career up.
This is an excellent attitute for an NCO "rival" of a junior officer to have.Quote:
Originally posted by Thierry:
This is basically what it all boils down to from a 12 year veteran in the greatest Navy in the whole worls. Enlisted are specialist they are there to learn one specific job and to become subject matter experts. Officers are generalist they learn a little bit about everything taught to them by senior enlisted personnel, JO (Junoir Officer) should do well if they are liked and respected by enlisted people, Officers careers can be made of broke by enlisted personel. Yes we can severly screw an officers career up.
Some long-service NCOs are resentful of officer authority, and attempt to bully junior officers because it gives them a feeling of acomplishment or control.
What most fail to realize is that it is their job to train and mentor the new officer... while at the same time not undermining their authority.
A good officer recognizes and utilizes the experience and ability of their NCOs... a good NCO passes that experience along, while recognizing that the officer not only has the authority, but bears the ultimate responsibility as well.
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"I'd rather die standing than live on my knees..."
Shania Twain
Well, it wouldn't be specific to Section 31... since Section 31 doesn't exist.Quote:
Originally posted by JALU3:
I always thought that the 'under bar' was ment to signify their status as Sec31 members, not to mention those uniforms. Do not in that episode, the two LT's in the shot also had the 'under bar'. Thus this means that the 'under bar' isn't specific to CAPT Sloan.
Therefore I would be careful if, inside game, or outside for that matter, if you meet an officer with a little gold line/bar underneath their pips. Don't start running, or they might get suspiciuos and come after you.
Crewman: "What's that bar under your rank insignia mean, Sir?"
Sloan: "It means I belong to a super-secret intelligence organization nobody knows about..."
It might mean he is an IG or Internal Affairs Officer... but since the ST costumes department seems to do such things for no reason whatsoever, I'd just ignore it.
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"I'd rather die standing than live on my knees..."
Shania Twain
Just a couple of comments:
1) yes, Virginia, the other branches have ranks between line and flag. The mnemonic device for non-naval ranks is "Be My Little General" which leads to Brigadier General, Major General, Lieutenant General, and General.
2) during WWII, we had Admirals of the Fleet and Generals of the Army.
3) for some good information/discussion of the differences between Fleet Captains and Commodores, check out the ST:TOS core book.
4) as a prior enlisted man who is returning after receiving his college degree to fly, I must admit I have a unique perspective on the whole enlisted/warrant/officer debate. To become a warrant officer in the US Navy, one must first be a chief petty officer and apply for the position. If accepted, the chief is warranted/commissioned. The only real difference between a warrant officer and any other officer is that after a warrant makes chief warrant officer 1, he is guaranteed to be promoted to the rest of the chief warrant officer ranks. Another way for an enlisted man to get commissioned is to become a Limited Duty Officer (LDO). This is a lot like a warrant officer, except it may be applied for at the petty officer first class rank. Also, he actually has to get reviewed to be promoted. Both a warrant and LDO usually serve under a line officer and have senior enlisted personnel under them.
If you have any further questions, please ask.
Welcome aboard, Arndog. It's good to have more military experience on the board.
I've never heard of the LDO. What kind of duties do they have in real life? What would they do in a ST campaign?
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:) <<<<
LUGTrek isn't really dead. Not as long as we remember it.
This reminds me of the fact that George Washington was the only ever six star general.
Okay you've got me there, why 6?Quote:
Originally posted by Robbert Raets:
This reminds me of the fact that George Washington was the only ever six star general.
5 I can understand, 6? Perhaps because he was in charge of the whole shindig?
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SIRSIG :D
AKA: SirPostalot
AKA: The MapMaker
AKA: The Trek Cartographer
AKA:...Well I could keep going forever ;)
The fundamental differences in officers can be surmised thusly:
1) there are Line Officers and Staff Officers
2) Line Officers can take command; Staff Officers cannot
3) Warrant Officers and Limited Duty Officers are ALWAYS Staff Officers
4) Warrant Officers are guaranteed promotion from WO-1 to CWO-3
5) LDOs are promoted like regularly commissioned officers
That's about all I can think of. Any further questions?