Is Star Trek dying?

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Originally posted by Chang
ST Titan?

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It could happen! ;)

Nothing quite like starting your own rumor.

Seriously, there have been a lot of comments on this thread about the continuing viability of Trek- many of them quite astute and perceptive. Upon reflection, I will change my choice to lull. But it won't last long. As long as we have fans like us here at TrekRPG.net there's not the faintest hope in hell of Star Trek dying off.

I'm an old fan and remember quite well the period between TAS and STMP. It was a renaissance of amateur fiction, conventions, conception, and artwork. If the same thing were to happen again I won't be unhappy. The true strength of Star Trek has always been with the fans- no matter who's running the official ship.

I think it's in a lull. While it was a good story and i think it's up there with #'s 2 and 6, there is no way it will be able to draw crowds from LOTR. This could very well spell the end of at least the movies.

Who was the marketing genuis who decided to release this film at Christmas time with LOTR opening the next week. This film was finnished durring the fall and could have been released around thanksgiving (the time most of the trek films have been relesed scince trek 4).

Enterprise on the other hand, while i do enjoy it, good use some better direction. They set up the Sulliban as the threat for this series, Lets use them! Here it is, almost mid season and we only had 1 story with them. Lets see some multi episode archs. let's see the Suliban trying to change history in the 22nd century. Let's see more of the plight that Suliban who are not in the Cabal suffer because of the ones who are!

It's like with Voyager when they relized that the Kazon as a threat were pretty dopey.

To summerize, it could use some better storry planning.

Looking at the box office figures today, I really don't think varying the release time would have done much. It would have "flooped" anytime.

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The solution, I don't know. I can speculate. But something needs to be done to energize the franchise. That probably means a risk, one that might fail. Yet staying the course seems doomed to fail.

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Here are my views on how Trek needs to be revitalized.

1. Throw out the sacred cows, as Dan said. If trek needs to be revitalized then we need to rethink everything (and I mean everything) about Trek. Not only to bring back the spark that make us fall in love with the francise in the first place but also bring new fans in. Purism and Braga's half hearted revisionism isn't working so its time for something radical.

2. Hire the best writers you can find. Look at the most beloved episodes in Trekdom and bring them back. Do whatever it takes to bring them back and writing - even if it means dipping into the special effects budget. Heck Enterprise has the best special effects I have seen in a series and obviously it isn't doing the ratings any good.

3. Take a hard look at Trek and find out what works and what doesn't both in terms of storylines and in terms of trek history. Be prepared to rewrite history - I love Trek continuity as much as anyone but honestly its getting in the way. Specifically the silly and ill-concieved plots, especially in the later years, that really gummed up the works. A serious retcon is in order, and at this point I really don't care as long as cleans up a lot of crap.

4. Make a new series. Look at the crew and design for maximum interaction (and in some cases conflict). Look at Firefly for an example. Don't see the crew or group as just a collection of interesting characters (though that should be concidered too), but in terms of the "group dynamic" as it were. Importantly, if you have a main character, use them, make us care about them, and have them develop both personally and professionally. No more Harry Kims who languish in Ensign-hell while guys like Paris get promoted-demoted-promoted. Don't necessarily jam them down our throats like Wesley but utilize in a meaningful way every once every two-or-three episodes and not ignore them in favour of Holograms, Ex-Borg Drones, and Half-Klingons.

5. Use the Arc format. I don't buy Braga and Bermans view that the episodic format is superior. Buffy, DS9 and Babylon 5 both proved that if a story is writen properly and has sufficent vision, a plot arc can work. The trick is mixing both episodic and arc elements. Lets not assume that public is too dumb or has too short an attension span in order to "get" a plot arc. The trick here is to grab the fan and make them want to watch every week - the big problem with Enterprise is that the individual shows are lackluster and the metaplot is moving too slowly. Bablyon 5 and DS9 had its share of poor episodes but the allure of the Shadow/Dominion War arc kept me turning in during these lulls in quality (as few as there were).

Now this might no help Trek. Heck, it might be the killing blow. Many of my examples, such as Firefly, boasted great acting, good interaction, and nifty plots (and plot arc) but it got cancelled. So, this might not save Trek.

But honestly, I'd rather have the franchise die that continue on life support for a few more years. Better go out in one big bang, a serious attempt to make a great television show and fail. No more riding on the coat-tails of the Trek legacy in hopes that one day the fans might come back. If Enterprise is all we have to look forward to, then it isn't going to happen.

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Originally posted by Capt.Hunter

I look back at DS9 and the better episodes of TNG and wonder where it all went wrong...

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My guess is when Rick Berman chose Braga to replace Michael Piller and Jeri Taylor as VOY executive producer.

JMHO, of course...

I think that there should be a year or two off, and that time should be used for development.

For what, you may ask?

I think that, with a new creative team in place, that there should be a new series called... Star Trek.

Seriously. I think that they should do a remake of TOS. Same characters, same background, new cast, new creative team. Keep a healthy respect for the original, but remake it as a new series for the 21st century.

When you have lost your way, sometimes the best place to go is back to the beginning...

YMMV

Hugh

As much as I love Star Trek, it's having a serious cardiac arrest. My suggestion would be to stabilize it (the end of Voyager did nothing to stabilize the universe, as a matter of fact, it did quite the opposite) and put it away for a decade. It's not like Paramount or any of the muckety-mucks are going to suffer with their already garnered riches.

It's become overexposed.

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Originally posted by Karg

Who was the marketing genuis who decided to release this film at Christmas time with LOTR opening the next week. This film was finnished durring the fall and could have been released around thanksgiving (the time most of the trek films have been relesed scince trek 4).

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Could they have push the film a little early, around the time of the James Bond movie (Die Another Day) or the second Harry Potter film?

Then again, this is about the same time they release Trek movies as in previous films. I can recall at least three Trek films prior to NEMESIS to be released closer to Christmas holiday.

But AFAIC, I'm going to see both films on Christmas day (now that I got the free moviepass when I bought the LOTR gift set). :cool:

I don't believe Trek needs time off. I believe what the Star Trek franchise needs is people who know how to tell good stories, put those stories into a teleplay, and then get that teleplay onto the screen.

From what I have seen, most of the recent stories for Enterprise have all been stories created by Berman and Braga and then pounded out by a staff writer. They shy away from strong choices, and go with the old and tried...which comes out as old and tried.

Enterprise has a lot of potential, but all of that potential is being buried in a vat of decontamination gel.

Berman and Braga need to step back a few paces, and let someone who can tell stories, who can write stories, and who can put those stories on the screen in a new, fresh, imaginative way.

If they can't step back, then I have a feeling that Trek will die.

Quack!

One reason that TOS and TNG has a lot of good stories is that Gene Roddenberry hired outside wirter and sci-fi writers to write episodes for the series. Voyager and Enterprise have suffered form the fact that there is only two people writing sstories for them.
What I would do is steal a page from MArvel and start a whole new universe..."Ultimate Trek" Start from scratch...and integrate the elements of Classic Trek in a new, fresh and consistent universe.

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Originally posted by Salinger

I don't believe Trek needs time off. I believe what the Star Trek franchise needs is people who know how to tell good stories, put those stories into a teleplay, and then get that teleplay onto the screen.

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Unfortunately, the people at Paramount do not have the testicles to fire Braga.

I'd rather they take the time off and regroup, even restructure the entire franchise.

Ultimate Trek eh? I like that idea :)

You should start a thread on it :)

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Originally posted by Highway Hoss

What I would do is steal a page from MArvel and start a whole new universe..."Ultimate Trek" Start from scratch...and integrate the elements of Classic Trek in a new, fresh and consistent universe.

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Isn't that what they're doing with ENTERPRISE? :p

Because that's what I keep telling myself, "This series is like Trek but it takes place in a different parallel reality or alternate universe." That way at the most I can tolerate the existence of the show (at the very least I ignore it completely).

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Originally posted by Salinger

Berman and Braga need to step back a few paces,

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"A few paces"? It would be more prudent if they just handed over their official letters of resignation.

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Originally posted by REG
Unfortunately, the people at Paramount do not have the testicles to fire Braga.

I'd rather they take the time off and regroup, even restructure the entire franchise.

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I don't think it's a matter of testicles. I think it's a matter that Paramount and the producers of Enterprise don't realize what crap they're shovelling out. I think it's more a problem with ignorance than having the brass to get rid of the Deadly Duo.

Quack!