ICON rules for Doctor Who

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This could lead to all sorts of conflicts. Imagine the Doctor using his TARDIS to save a primitive society from a nuclear blast. Now imagine there’s a Starfleet starship secretly watching in orbit!

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I don't see any conflict there. Starfleet: "Phew. I was worried I might have to either break the rules or watch a civilization destroy itself. I'm sure glad things worked themselves out." Even the most legalistic nit-picker would take action. That time lord is not a federation citizen. Now, if the time lord was doing BAD things, they might work themselves up to "protect the vulnerable civilization from outside influence." Or they might not... it depends whose writing this episode. (note: the version of the Prime Directive in the Player's Handbook [thanks Don] is still true to the Star Trek ethos, but it doesn't go so insanely far as certain interpretations go. More importantly, it fits what we see in the episodes.)

Diamond said
Starfleet: "Phew. I was worried I might have to either break the rules or watch a civilization destroy itself. I'm sure glad things worked themselves out."

Starfleet would not say this. The Captain and crew might say this and maybe even an Admiral might say this but “Starfleet” would not say this. The only thing Starfleet would say it what is written in “The Book.”
The problem is that everyone who did say “Phew. I was worried...” will lie awake that night and wonder why its ok for any old (non-UFP) guy to break the Prime Directive while trained, experienced, responsible Starfleet officers are forbidden because they might mess things up?
When they answer that question they might feel that they need to go on the run from their own people in an out-of-date ship they stole. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/biggrin.gif

Diamond said
“Even the most legalistic nit-picker would take action.”

If you mean “even the most legalistic nit-picking Starfleet officer would save the people from their own nuke” you are wrong. In the TNG episode “Homeward” Picard refused to save the people of Borall II when the planets atmosphere was being destroyed. And the people in question were even responsible for the destruction of the atmosphere (unlike my hypothetical case where the people were paying the price for building to many nukes).
Picard is far from the legalistic nitpicker in Starfleet, yet he was willing to condemn and entire innocent civilization. Just think what Picard would do if he saw the Doctor using his Time Machine to save people from their own foolishness!

If its ok for a stranger from another universe to interfere then careful, well thought out, pre-planned interference by Starfleet officers should be ok too. The fact that it isn’t shows the injustice of the Prime Directive. And the Doctor LOVES to deal with injustice! http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/wink.gif


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Just remember, even though it’s a vacuum,
In space no one can hear you Clean.
-J.T.

Quote:

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Originally posted by J T:
Just think what Picard would do if he saw the Doctor using his Time Machine to save people from their own foolishness!

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For what it is worth, the player characters regard X (the Time Lord) as an unmitigated pain in the ass. This was not my intetion nor did I anticipate this - so I have kept his apperances to a minium.

The only trouble I see hear is don't most of the Federations laws only bind Federation citizens (outside of old fashion murder and such of course)? The Doctor wouldn't have to operate under the Federations influence. So what if there was a SF ship watching from orbit?

Besides they would never be able to hold the good Doctor for more then an hour. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/biggrin.gif

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In the Praetors Name!

Sorry, I mistyped. When I said, "Even the most legalistic nit-picker would take action" I mean to type "would NOT take action." Clearly, the legalistic nit-pickers would not act to save the planet while the Kirk-esque mavericks would. What I meant was not even the legalistic nit-pickers would try to thwart the Doctor.

Yep. That sort of thing just might send them off in maverick independant actions in outdated ships. That or join Section 31.

One has to assume that sometime in the Enterprise-era, there were some terrible tragedies as a result of well-intentioned interventions. Perhaps after Starfleet's fixing pollution in a planet's atmosphere, the inhabitants became dependant on that. Not changing their way of life or the polluting technologies, there was an even WORSE pollution crisis shortly thereafter.

What happened to Borall II in the end of "Homeward"? I'm sure I would remember if a planet died off in the series, and I only missed two episodes.

What would Picard do if he saw the Doctor intervening? "We're not allowed to do that. I think in the long term what you're doing will hurt this civilization (insert oratory here)." That's all. Unless the time lord was activly HURTING the civilization (Master using a machine to increase pollution for nefarious ends), Picard wouldn't have stopped him by force. I just don't see it.

In a crossover, it's impotant to respect the themes (and characterization) of BOTH sides of the crossover. Otherwise you're telling less strong a story than you might otherwise.

Diamond said:
“What happened to Borall II in the end of "Homeward"? I'm sure I would remember if a planet died off in the series, and I only missed two episodes.”

Worf’s brother kidnapped a bunch of the people and tricked them using a holodeck. Picard was very upset but didn’t have the heart to beam the people into space so he went along with Worf’s brother’s plan. The kidnapped people were dropped off on some other planet (without realizing that they had been transported). The rest of the people of Borall II died when their atmosphere was destroyed. I think Worf’s brother stayed behind with the survivors (presumably renouncing his UFP citizenship).

The point is that Worf’s brother was the hero and Picard and the Enterprise crew were (if not the villains) then at least the obstacle to be tricked/persuaded.

Diamond said:
“What would Picard do if he saw the Doctor intervening? ...Picard wouldn't have stopped him by force. I just don't see it.”

I’m not sure if Picard would have stopped him or not. It Picard truly believes that the Prime Directive is “The Right Thing to Do” then he might feel obligated to stop the Doctor’s interference.
Either the Prime Directive is the UFP’s highest law (in which case almost ANY violation is an EVIL act).
Or the Prime Directive is like the speeding limit. (It’s not evil, just dangerous. For example driving 88 miles an hour can sometimes save lives and is thus justifiable).
Its clear which side Kirk was on. It’s also obvious that the Doctor (almost) completely ignores the issue.

What was Janeway reaction to the two Ferengie who set themselves up as gods/leaders in the Delta Quadrant? Were those Ferengie Violating the Prime Directive (they certainly weren’t UFP Citizens)?

Diamond said:
“In a crossover, it's important to respect the themes (and characterization) of BOTH sides of the crossover. Otherwise you're telling less strong a story than you might otherwise.”

I’d also say its important to showcase the differences (IDIC and all that) between the universe. Neither Theme (or characterization) should be portrayed as BETTER. But the conflict between them can provide a very rich area to mine for RPG material.

A story that puts the Doctor and the Starfleet crew in ethical (not physical) opposition would showcases the strengths and weaknesses of BOTH sides. Players on either side would have to justify WHY they do the things they do.


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Just remember, even though it’s a vacuum,
In space no one can hear you Clean.
-J.T.

I certainly can agree with that, JT.

What an interesting conumdrum.

In my RPG groups, I like it when my players create characters from different cultures with different outlooks. The roleplaying that occurs can be fun and interesting.

There is, of course, the problem that player conflict can seriously disrupt the game. Either slowing down the episode or stopping it altogether.

Compromise ... is the answer. But finding out who and how is where the fun is.

Hey a quick question...

Does anyone know where I could find a list of all the Dr. Who FASA material that was published.

I think I have all the DW RPG stuff that they ever made, but I have no way of verifying it. Anybody know what was released (or were I would go to find out)?


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Just remember, even though it’s a vacuum,
In space no one can hear you Clean.
-J.T.

IT IS FINISHED!

JT (or BS as I’m known to my friends at the game table) has finished the [insert drum roll]…

THE TARDIS OPERATOR’S HANDBOOK!!!!

Or at least the first draft is finished. http://216.40.212.6/Board/ubb/wink.gif
I’ve got Craig Hinton (4 time Doctor Who novelist) looking it over (when he has time) but Craig’s experience with RPGs appears (I could be wrong) to be limited. So…

Bytus, Diamond, and Grumpy, I was wondering if you guys would be interested in looking it before I put it on the web?
If so then email me and I’ll send it to you as a Word document.

My email address is willbswift@hotmail.com

Of course if there’s anyone else out there who believes themselves to be an expert at all things TARDISy then feel free to drop me an email.


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Just remember, even though it’s a vacuum,
In space no one can hear you Clean.
-J.T.

Hi, just passing through, an idea for scenarii involving cross overs with the Doctor Who universe : what if a Federation starship found herself lost in an alternate universe : Doctor Who's, of course! The players would have to cope with Cybermen, Daleks, Sontarans... and a very different Earth (I don't remember DrWho chronology precisely, but I know its 2370's Earth is not much StarTrekesque...)

And otherwise, I just want to say that it's a pleasure to read all the stuff that have been published on this topic. I'm new on this board, but for now you guys never stop to impress me.
Well, maybe one day it'll be up to me.

Anyway - newbie out. Sorry for the interruption.

JT: Great work on that Tardis Operator's manual! I particularly like two things. First of course there's the ICON (and GURPS and timelord) transelations for the FASA material. Great stuff. Second, I liked how you color code the information by source so one can easily pick and choose which information you as GM accept as cannon. And of course your completeness is staggering as usual.

I can think of two suggestions. First, include a key explaining which color code means what. Unless I just missed it (it's a big document).

Second, I suggest altering the ICON skill chart. My interpretation of FASA's Doctor Who skills would be more like so:
Unskilled = 0 ICON skill
Untrained = 0(1) ICON skill
Basic = 1(2) ICON skill. (one if its a general skill, 2 for specialties.
Average = 2(3) ICON
Professional = 3(4) ICON
Expert = 4(5) ICON
Mastery = 5(6) ICON
God-like is out of the ICON range.


[This message has been edited by Diamond (edited 09-11-2001).]

Diamond said:
“JT: Great work on that Tardis Operator's manual!”

Thanks! I’m glad you like it.

Diamond said:
“I particularly like two things. First of course there's the ICON (and GURPS and timelord) transelations for the FASA material. Great stuff.”

Those weren’t much more then an afterthought, but I’m glad you liked them.

Diamond said:
“Second, I liked how you color code the information by source so one can easily pick and choose which information you as GM accept as cannon.”

In an issue as sticky as Dr. Who continuity I always try to error on the side of caution. It also helps me when I discover new, contradicting, info I can easily decided where it is “more cannon” then the old data. I stole the idea from those Bibles with all of Jesus’s writing in red.

Diamond said:
“And of course your completeness is staggering as usual.”

I was certainly staggered. I had to read 2 Star Wars and 1 Star Trek novel just to get TARDISes out of my head. I still can’t look at a hexagon with a straight face. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/wink.gif

Diamond said:
“I can think of two suggestions.”

OH GOODY GOODY!!!

Diamond said:
“First, include a key explaining which color code means what. Unless I just missed it (it's a big document).”

It should have been at the beginning of the document (right under the title)…
Maybe you didn’t get the whole thing. It should be 43 pages long.

For the record the color code is:
RED for information from the TV Series, including the Dimensions in Time, and Universal/BCC Telemovie
PURPLE for information from the Novels including Target Virgin, BCC, and I Who (which isn't a novel but it's source material is)
YELLOW information is from 'licensed' reference sources such as the Technical Manual, Monsters, and The Gallifrey Chronicles.
GREEN information is from 'unreliable' sources including FASA's role-playing game, and the Time Lord RPG. WHITE is information from unofficial sources. Mostly my own speculation, with a little from Craig Hinton and other fan speculation.

Diamond said:
“Second, I suggest altering the ICON skill chart.”

I see your point. I should take specialization into account. I’m not sure if I agree with completely with your table. You have to have SOME experience to get a level I so it should be at least a 0(1) skill. What do you think of this?

Unskilled (I) = 0(1)
Untrained (II) = 1(2)
Basic (III) = 2(3)
Average (IV) = 3(4)
Professional (V) = 4(5)
Expert (VI) = 5(6)
Mastery (VII) = 6(6)

Thanks for the comments! Any other complaints or pointers?


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Just remember, even though it’s a vacuum,
In space no one can hear you Clean.
-J.T.

For the complete Star Trek equipment list see
http://www.geocities.com/willbswift/costchart.html

It’s been a few weeks. Did you guys who got a copy of my TARDIS Operator’s Handbook have any Suggestions/Comments/Critics/Complaints?

I’m finishing up a revision to the piece and was wondering if you had anything to add?