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I don't like them.
Sure, the idea of Romulans having to deal with technologically advanced, paternalistic nabobs of political correctness is kinda cool, and I like the shen, but the expansion of the idea–the description of the war, their ships, and especially the question of what, exactly, you do with them in an episode–doesn't seem like it gets the best out of the basic idea.
Why does this feel like a verbatim repost? And what does it have to do with General RP, Systems, & Mechanics (maybe it was a repost from Narrator's Ready Room, where it seems a better fit). And what the heck are the Taurhai?!
It wasn't system-specific, nor is it relating to specific Narration issues (i.e. I'm not using them in an episode).Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex
They're the 'other, unseen enemy' for the Romulans from Way of D'era.
How similar is this race to the ISC of Starfleet Command 2?
If I recall correctly, the Taurhai embody similar ideals like the Federation. In fact the Federation and the Taurhai would get along quite well if not for the Taurhai habit of forcing their views on others. In other words - no prime directive.
The Taurhai, more advanced than the Federation or the Romulans, view everyone else as in need of education and have no qualms messing with prewarp Civilizations. Peacefully if possible, but they resort as likely to more drastic measures on their quest to bring peace and unity to the Galaxy.
I think they can be regarded as an antithesis to the Borg. Instead of assimilating a Society and taking the useful parts, they force other cultures to assimilate to their culture. It all reminds me of 19th century imperialism. The Taurhai taking the parts of the educated Europeans bringing Culture to the savages.
Rudyard Kipling formulated it this way:
Take up the White Man's burden—
Send forth the best ye breed—
Go, bind your sons to exile
To serve your captives' need;
To wait, in heavy harness,
On fluttered folk and wild—
Your new-caught sullen peoples,
Half devil and half child.
Ahem, getting carried of again - sorry:D :D
As far as I recall the Romulans gave the Taurhai a frosty welcome and bested their fleet in a desperate battle halting their advance. All this taking place just before TNG first encountered the Romulans in Season 1.
To be honest, they don't seem like the kind of dudes who would even have a fleet. Given the level of the rest of their technology, I'd expect them to just use the shen to teleport from planet to planet, spreading their love of taurité to poor benighted civilisations like a bunch of big-headed Merlins.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Otto
The colonialism parallel doesn't really hold up when it comes to the Taurhai, though–they're not using it as a moral justification for economic exploitation (unlike the Romulans... ).
The core idea of the Taurhai makes sense... but it doesn't jive with how it's developed. I couldn't see it working as an episode of Star Trek. I'm sort of disappointed with the wasted potential.
Just took a look at Way of Dera the way they are depicted there they attacked the Romulans first - and they if i recall the Romulan SRM correctly their Dragon ships were not only weired looking but packed quite some punch as well.
IMHO they are just Imperialists hiding behind a mask of a benign civilisation. Much like the Romulans they treat everyone else as an inferior.
Lastly the Taurhai are just a easy explanation for the Romulan absence in Alpha Quadrant affairs for nearly 50 years after the Tomed Incident.
An explanation that doesn't necessarily need to be military distraction. Romulan xenophobia could simply be a phase their culture goes through–as they focus inward on restoring good, clean fascist living to planets tainted by contact with lowly outsiders.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Otto
Anyway, the Taurhai's description lacks a connection between their military activities–with whole fleets and shipyards and presumably some sort of military service for individuals–and their cultural description. Their culture, which I'm okay with, paints a picture of slightly less neurotic Talosians, bopping around with their super-wands having sexy parties and playing cute games. And then, somehow, vaguely, they also manage an interstellar empire. It doesn't really mesh. Also, could be more threatening.
If my notes take on a more concrete form, perhaps I'll post them here.
Well if they are driven by the "white man's burdon" in the foreign affairs . . . that would lead them to be expansionist . . . with an imperial ting by staying on as "cultural advisors" to mold them to be more "civilized, and peaceful."
Think of it the way the Islamist see the world (not to get political, if so, I am just trying to create a similar modern day way of thinking for a GM to relate to when playing this race). They preach that they want peace and unity in the world around them . . . but a peace and unit which conforms to the way they think the world around them should be . . . and if others will not except their vision of peace and harmony, then the conversion should be made any way possible.
So they see themselves as higher, more moral, more jovial civilization, and all the worlds need to be more like them. They see the Alpha and Beta Quadrant, and they see an area ripe for conversion.
Sure, within their own borders, in areas where everything is peaceful and alligned to their way of thought, they may have wild crazy sexy dance parties, with Burt Bacharach and Frank Sinatra Jr. . . . but that doesn't mean that's how it is on the borders.
Look, I get the damn idea, dammit! No matter how many times you explain the concept behind it, the irony of the Romulan colonizers being colonized, my aesthetic and practical reaction to it remains. It doesn't feel like something that could happen in an episode of Star Trek: I don't see how, exactly, they'd really present exciting antagonists in an actual episode you'd run. Nor is there enough of an explanation of what the crew of a Star-Dragon would actually do on contact with other species. Do they just talk at them for a while until they start shooting out of boredom? It sounds like it. At the very least, give us an example of the actual spiel the Taurhai give them, instead of 'We're here to give you enlightenment and um, make you happy and stuff."Quote:
Originally Posted by JALU3
And the vast majority of Islamists, probably all, are primarily concerned with Muslim society within their own borders. The existence of non-Islamic states are not a problem so far as they do not appear to interfere with the interior workings Islamic states. Sure, I don't think anyone on these boards are going to be strongly opinionated on burkha-wearing, but let's not ascribe imperialist motives to homegrown reactionism. It's just another expression of anti-globalization resistance, same as Seattle and Quebec City.
So, possibility one: They introduce posteconomic technologies that replace previous forms of industry and production. This is essentially taking over by giving people free stuff. The stick of this otherwise carroty equation is the Taurhai's demands that everyone play nice or they remove their access to the free candy machines. This possibility would lead to societies resembling 'Riders of the Purple Wage' (wiki it).
Possibility two: Brainwashing, possibly literal. Some go-getting overachiever in Taurhai society is likely to be an expert in behavioural sciences, and with what is likely very advanced medical technology, the ability to change behaviour patterns in aliens seems like something they'd invest in. With an ideology firmly convinced that scoring taurité points is the Best Thing Evar, using your technology to cure galaxy-wide insanity and forming healthy Prisoner-esque societies is only logical. It's medicative psychotherapy gone mad! Or at least gone Victorian. Which is pretty similar.
You could combine the two. Aliens show up with magical food machines, that make you like them when you partake of it.
Next: Star-dragons and shen
Just ease back a touch there, no need to get heated. This is a discussion and seeing as its an RPG based on a TV series there is a REALLY simple solution to the situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
If you dont like the concept of the Taurhai, dont use them... Job done.
I'm not, really. I was kind of frustrated that most of the responses were different people repeating the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Gurden
And I like the concept. It's the implementation of it that I'm reworking.Quote:
If you dont like the concept of the Taurhai, dont use them... Job done.
I'd like to see a new approach to the theme as well.:)Quote:
And I like the concept. It's the implementation of it that I'm reworking.
Anybody else have GURPS: Infinite Worlds?
It's been a while since I read up on the Taurhai, but they've got me thinking of Centrum at the moment.
Thet might lead to an idea for a new way to present them, I don't know. I've forgotten their rationalization for their actions.
Well there's an interesting way to make ideoligical conversion/persuasion . . . through advance technology . . . sending out happy beams . . . ultra-delicious thought changing (provoking) goodies . . . ultra-frequency sybliminal messages interwoven into all greetings. The power of the root beer . . . but different.
Interplanetary media/add campaigns! You think Halo 3 went overboard . . . watch out you haven't seen what these new guys do! Imagine them with a manhatten publicity/advertising arm, with the production capability of a hundred chinas, and the prowess of media of dozens of hollywoods. Man, Goebbels would die to have their ability of persuasion. Or maybe they have their own version of Goebbels.
That has to make me wonder, is their a darker side to their "paradise". Maybe reeducation camps or something like that.
By hook, or by crook...Quote:
Originally Posted by JALU3
I think the Husnock works better as they were wiped out by a Douwd in a TNG third season episode, The Survivors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Otto
Well you could use the Husnock any way you like them to, there is almost nothing known about them safe what the Douwd who killed them all told Picard (Pretty pointless "-They killed my wife and i think they were all evil, so i killed them all in a single mad moment with just a thought).
Wait a Sec... Mental note for a Time Travel Adventure: Probably a Test instigated by Q who wants to find out if the crew is willing to accept the Douwds explanation or judge for themselves. During the Course of the Adventure it turns out that the Hussnock were worried about the Federation and in their mind wanted a strong Position to start negotiations with e.g. taking the Colony Hostage for Information and some "bargaining chips". Due to unfortunate Circumstances the Situation Escalates and first all Colonists perish and then the Douwd eradicates the Husnock in retribution.
Time for some moral dillemma. The Test also could feature Picard accused by Q for not punishing the Douwd for his actions.