Hey guys.
I was wondering if some of you have read the relaunch novels of Enterprise?
As far as I know there are three and they supposebly un-do something clearly depicted in the run of the show...
Some insights please, if you will... :)
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Hey guys.
I was wondering if some of you have read the relaunch novels of Enterprise?
As far as I know there are three and they supposebly un-do something clearly depicted in the run of the show...
Some insights please, if you will... :)
As long as that something is "These Are the Voyages..." I'm cool with it.
I gathered from different wiki-sources that it is somehting in connection with the main point of criticism of said episode....
That it existed?
Hey, if the novels could do that, I'd like to introduce the first book in my new adventure novella series, Starship Voyager and the Order of Hakon!.Quote:
Originally Posted by PGoodman13
Nah, I think not that the whole episode was removed ;)
Actually I can't say for sure, as I have not watched the entire fourth season of ENT (yet). I stopped after the Soong-story arc and I haven't read a single ENT novel. So I once more pose my opening question, that read like this :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cut
Well, Cut, after reading this, I did digging, and probably found out what you found out.
It is intersting that the novels are going to go against canon; one source did say this is something that usually doesn't happen after something becomes canon (you could, before First Contact, write a story where the Borg are actually sentient, technological parasites, but after FC and most of VOY, that would take some major explaining).
I think that while I didn't like the waydied a stupid, pointless death, that's what the writers decided to do, so we're stuck with it.:( I guess you could have just brought him back in some Trekish manner (time travel, alternate dimention counterpart, clone, etc.), rather than having it be some kind of elaborate plot, but I guess that's my opinion.
So, in the Novels, did they actually show the speach that led to the founding of the FED? (that, was my other major problem with this time-lost TNG epidsode: you tell us this is THE speach, and then you DON'T SHOW IT? Not even a little?)
In terms of conniving workarounds of canon, I feel this is one of the most elegant...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky
I've only read the 1st novel when they did the change(which I hated & thought was stupid when they did it in "These Are the Voyages..."),but I'm looking forward when I get the chance to read the follow up stories.When I got done with the book I was actually ticked that I had to wait till they got the next one out.
I didn't catch the 3rd or 4th season of Enterprise and only read a couple of the early Enterprise novels. What are the "relaunch" novels and I assume you are talking about the final episode of Enterprise as a canon buster. Can someone bring me up to speed as to whats happening in this corner of the Trekverse?
Okay, so, spoilers.Quote:
Originally Posted by K.G. Carlson
The last episode of ENT involved Riker playing out a holonovel version of the NX-01's last mission, wherein Trip dies ignominiously. I'm sure it was supposed to resemble a heroic sacrifice, but Berman and Braga don't have those particular writing chops...
Anyway, everyone hated it. Terrible episode, stupid death. I never liked Trip anyway so what do I know. So when the novel's 'relaunch' comes around, the writers decide that the historical record was constructed by Section 31 to conceal some other complicated plot I don't know about because I'm just quoting memory beta at this point.
Now Tripp was my favorite:) .Hated the epsiode,wish they'ed done it with Shatner the way they originally were.(Shat was going to turn out to be Kirk's grandpa who was Chef.) The only parts I like were the scenes at the end leading up to the speech & the ending where all the Enterprise Captains were doing the "Where No Man...." lines & showing each Enterprise.
The relaunch follows several plot threads from the 3th season.It was nicely done & for the most part tryed to be respectful of its soruce matterial.(with the exception of the last episode & they tryed to fix it the best they could.)
M'kay.
Trip was given the opportunity to be surgically altered and planted as a spy on Romulus to keep the Romulans from developing a high-warp engine that would give them overwhelming superiority in space. He took it. The death was 'staged" and entered into the official record (which is why it was in Riker's holonovel.)
The most recent books tell the story of the Kobayashi Maru and the beginning of the Romulan War, and the authors have started working to bring ENT in-line with TOS canon, even coming up with digestible reasons why the TOS Enterprise and technology is "retro" compared to ENT.
Also, for those who hated the NX-Class, after the first 6 are built, there's a reason Starfleet chose not to make any more. Ties in with the reason for the retro design.
Plus, by the end of the Romulan War book, all but two of the NX-ships are asploded (and one of those two goes missing - see the "Destiny" trilogy for more on its fate.)
is retro or looks retro?Quote:
Originally Posted by First of Two
According to Doug Drexler the NX class was supposed to be a similar colour to the original Enterprise. He was surprised to see that it had been darkened to a metallic colour when the series aired.
The most recent books tell the story of the Kobayashi Maru and the beginning of the Romulan War, and the authors have started working to bring ENT in-line with TOS canon, even coming up with digestible reasons why the TOS Enterprise and technology is "retro" compared to ENT.
...To a disgusting, RETARDEDLY mediocre shade of dark grey, blech.
I've been enjoying reading the novels. I also Run an Enterprise era RPG and I treat the NX01 as if it hadnt been 'painted' yet. Essentially she's sent on her first mission before the final coat has been put on:)
I would not at all mind seeing some spoilers for that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by First of Two
What novel has the begining of the Romulon wars and what novels are after that one? :)
I haven't read anyone of them but it sounds like the novel writers are getting back on track. I didnt mind Enterprise but the "look" bothered me a bit.
thanks!
Mike
Originally Posted by First of Two
The most recent books tell the story of the Kobayashi Maru and the beginning of the Romulan War, and the authors have started working to bring ENT in-line with TOS canon, even coming up with digestible reasons why the TOS Enterprise and technology is "retro" compared to ENT.
Also, for those who hated the NX-Class, after the first 6 are built, there's a reason Starfleet chose not to make any more. Ties in with the reason for the retro design.
Could you be a bit more specific, I'm rather curious why Starfleet goes to the TOS "retro" technology.
Small corrction First of Two, of the 6 NX class starships Columbia, Challenger, Discovery, and Atlantis are either lost or destroyed in the early months of the war, and it is one of these that is discovered to have "gone missing".Quote:
Originally Posted by First of Two
On a side note, I wish we had good deckplans for the Deadalus class, since it's the main vessel used in the ERW.
No reply to this huh?
No reply to what?
__________________________________________________ ______________
Originally Posted by First of Two
The most recent books tell the story of the Kobayashi Maru and the beginning of the Romulan War, and the authors have started working to bring ENT in-line with TOS canon, even coming up with digestible reasons why the TOS Enterprise and technology is "retro" compared to ENT.
Also, for those who hated the NX-Class, after the first 6 are built, there's a reason Starfleet chose not to make any more. Ties in with the reason for the retro design.
__________________________________________________ ______________
Originally Posted by skree
Could you be a bit more specific, I'm rather curious why Starfleet goes to the TOS "retro" technology.
A resonse to the statement directly above.
The Romulans main weapon is a computer virus and remote control system refered to a the "tele-capture" weapon. This allows the Romulans to remotely take control of enemy vessels, those based on Vulcan technology are the most vulnerable, Earth ships are the least susceptable. Engineers realise the best way to protect ships from the weapon is to "segragate" control stations, thereby slowing the infection and making it easier to detect and purge. This leads to the seperation of helm and navigation into two stations, and also to Dax complaining about the colour scheme.
Control interfaces will also be simplified, replacing touch screens with switches.
Thank you this came in handy
I'm actually looking at starting a NX-01-era campaign at the moment. I was going to start it in about 2156 and follow through the Romulan war (which I was planning on making more like the occasional border-skirmish, to be honest) and finally the founding of the Federation.
But I love the look of the NX-01, so I was going to push it further, completely non-canonically, and have an upgrade of the class actually be the Daedalus class (so I can keep using the deckplans and the like). Basically, the NXs were the "hand-built" models, while the Daedalus' are the upgraded, production-line version (I was going to incorporate several changes, including a slightly faster warp drive and the first operational Starfleet deflector shields, "sponsored" by the Vulcans in their newfound spirit of cooperation, thanks to T'pau, et. al.)
So my canon's going to diverge from official (well, novelistic) canon quite dramatically, but I think it should still be fun...
Would you also add a secondary hull? The new "Ships of the Line" calender has a inproved version of the NX class.
http://julalien.files.wordpress.com/...helinecent.jpg
PS: Sorry about the size, but everything else I found was either too small or much larger.
That is gorgeous, Zero! I'm sooooo tempted...the only problem will be fitting it with the existing deckplans. I'm incredibly anally-retentive about such things (mainly because my players are), so I'd need to rejig them a fair bit...but goodness...that is SO tempting!! :)
Looking at it, and remembering what I can about the NX deckplans I've seen online, the only things you'd have to move would be main engineering and the shuttle bay. Oh and things like matter/anti-matter tankage.
You could always try to find the person who did the plans and ask them nicely to have a look at the refit design.
Considering the instigator of the refit was Doug Drexler, I'd be surprised if there weren't deckplans lurking online already...Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroArmour
ps. and stealing BSG's 'retrotech' justification when totally unnecessary = super lame. The NX just looks more high-tech to the 80s-90s Ron Cobb/Syd Mead generation; but JJ's Enterprise looks more 60s than the original. Look at the iPhone; the future looks like the future again.
I've spent several hours Googling and haven't found anything, but I did find the following post by the guy who created the awesome NX-01 deckplans I've been using (from The Enterprise Project)
His words were:
Which, to me, means "bummer!" with a big capital B! :(Quote:
I have no plans to do anything with Doug's refit right now. Actually, after four years, I am about burnt slam out on the NX-01. My next project (which I have already started tinkering with a little) will be as far away from Trek as I can get.
(I hope to show you folks the first piece from the new project before fall! I am very excited about what I am doing and I have a feeling some of you old school scifi fans will be too.)
But that doesn't mean I won't change my mind in the future though. I can't really say either way.
Doesn't matter to me, really. I'll just be running with my original idea. One thing I did learn with all this looking is that the Daedalus-class being the spherical primary hull and tubular engineering hull isn't actually canonical anyway. I dunno what it is - but that design just doesn't do it for me, whereas I can hand-wave using the NX-01 as the basis for the "new breed".
So basically, my timeline is something like:
2151: NX-01 Enterprise launched.
2154: NX-02 Columbia launched.
2155: NX-03 and NX-04 Challenger and Discovery launched. The Vulcans are now being more forthcoming in sharing technology with humans, and the Andorians and Tellarites have helped as well, in the new spirit of cooperation fostered by the formation of the Coalition of Planets. As such, we are now looking at a Warp 6 engine and an early deflector shield becoming available. It is decided that the NX-class is too resource-intensive to essentially "hand-build", so a production-line variant, the Daedalus-class is planned, using the same basic structure but with the improved warp drive and shield generators.
I'm keeping the Daedalus itself to being the first ship with the warp 7 engine, incidentally. For the moment, the first mass-produced ships are keeping the naming convention of Earth space shuttles. Soooo...the first one (which will be the "game ship") will be the Atlantis, followed by the Endeavour. So the further timeline will be:
2156: NC-05 and NC-06 Atlantis and Endeavour launched.
2157 onward: the next series are launched with upgraded (to warp 7) drives (Atlantis and Endeavour will be refitted with them).
Daedalus
Icarus
Iapyx
Perdix
Theseus
Ariadne
Agememnon
Achilles
Chryseis
Thetis
Menelaus
Diomedes
Laertes
Odysseus
...and many, many more! :) I managed to resist tying in the name Nausicaa (as another character in The Odyssey) for obvious reasons! :)
I think it'll work, though. I don't think it catastrophically damages anything canonical, and it still lets me use the deckplans I want to use.
Oh, I almost forgot - these are the revised stats for the NC-05 Atlantis:
Name: Atlantis
Registry: NC-05
Class & Type: Daedalus-class light explorer (modified NX class)
Hull Data
Structure: 25
Size/Decks: 5/7
Length/Height/Beam: 225/29/136
Complement: 121
Propulsion Data
Impulse: SBD (0.6c) (B)
Warp: WE-6 (3/4.5/6) (B)
Operational Data
Atmosphere Capable: Yes
Cargo Units: 50
Life Support: Class 3 (D)
Operations Systems: Class 2 (C)
Sensor Systems: Class 2 (+2/+1/+0/+0/+0) (C)
Shuttlebay: 2 aft
Shuttlecraft: 10 size worth
Grapplers: 2 fv
Transporters: 1 standard
Tactical Data
Pulsed Phase Cannon: PC-25 (x3/AA)
Penetration: 3/3/3/0/0
Torpedo Launchers: Mk 2IF (AA)
Photonic Penetration: 3/3/3/0/0
Deflector Shield: PFF 1 (A)
Protection/Threshold: 12/2
Miscellaneous Data
Manouvre Modifiers: +2 C, +0 H, +2 T
Traits: None
I don't think there are any glaring errors. I fudged around a little on the shields with regard to the timeline so I could get them a little earlier, but otherwise I think the ship stacks up.
Unfortunately no one I've talked to can find any refit NX class plans, which leaves us SOL on that score.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
I disagree that it's lame. It's actually quite a logical solution to the problem of the ERW. How come we never knew what they looked like 'til 2266? Because they used a series of unique tactics to fight a war they weren't technologically or industrially ready for.
There's plenty of other names from the space program to use, if you want to continue the Enterprise name list. Gagarin, Armstrong, Soyuz, Vostok, Gemini, Shenzhou, Charybdis, Phoenix...
The implication given at the end of ENT s4 was that it would be in deep space, over deep-space targets, for the purpose of discouraging large-scale interstellar commerce and communication to undermine the political and economic support of those who would oppose whatever their plan was after the collapse of the puppet Vulcan High Command. Although who knows if Sussman was really thinking it out that far...Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroArmour
Implications are all well and good, but at the end of the day what do you really have? Not much. And what implications are you talking about? A remote controlled ship? Not much of a strech to go from that to hacking into a ships control systems.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
Yeah, it might be to involved and realpolitik for a show on UPN or FOX or wherever the hell it was showing. But cribbing mercilessly from the BSG revamp because they agree with Schneider about wanting Mayao's designs onscreen or whatever seems a little weak.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroArmour
Sorry, but I don't know most for what you're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
Explain.
That's true...I was just going more for the Greek mythology concept, ala Daedalus.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King