CODA Starship combat explanation plz

Hi There

I am really new to the game .. had it for ages never really started reading it until today ... i am going to be starting a game soon enough .. but i am having a hard time understanding starship combat ... like if i were to have a ship that has more then one weapon system ....example the defiant it has four cannons on it .. i dont understand how you get the damage from the other three cannons when it fires on a target .. or how it is accounted for... explanation on this be great too

also i was wondering if some one could give me a simplistic example of combat so i can understand it ...i know this is alot to ask but i really would like to know ... thank you to whomever takes the time to answer this post.. i really appreciate it


Korga

Happy to help, but I am holding my 16 month year old daughter right now. I will be back to give you more here, but in the meantime here are two links that can help.

First, my sensor house rule:

http://forum.trek-rpg.net/showthread.php?t=10854

Second, here is a combat that took place in our story on my website (it will require some reading, bu tit is one full round):

http://rpg.avioc.org/boards/index.php/topic,409.0.html


maybe, too, someone will come along to give you more before I get bak.

thanks for trying to help me out i appreciate it and took your pdf to add to my rule set:)..... just still caqnt figure out how the phasers work on a ship that has four of them ...example : pulse type 1 (x4 D) 6/5/0/0 does that mean when damage occurs you take the 6 and times that number by 4 to represent each of the cannons?

The CODA combat system is designed to be abstract in order to facilitate "theatrical" combat. It was never intended as a detailed "simulation" system (such as Star Fleet Battles or Harpoon).

The starship construction (and combat) rules group the weapons into batteries by type.

The listed damage is for a single salvo from that weapons group.

Using the example you gave from the Defiant Class: Type 1 Pulse Phasers (x4 D) 6/5/5/0

A single salvo from all four phasers would do 6 points of damage at Point Blank range, and 5 points at Short and Medium ranges.

A salvo from her quantum torpedoes would do 4 points of damage at all ranges.



To make things even more abstract, the "number of weapons" aboard a ship is essentially a guesstimate (usually about half) of how many weapons will bear on the target at any given moment, rather than those "officially" listed on the "actual" vessel.

The Galaxy Class (pg 148) is listed as having five (six, if you count the concealed weapon) phasers.

The Next Generation Tech Manual lists ten separate banks- and the "uprated" vessels in the DS9 Tech Manual have more still.
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There was (allegedly) a detailed starship combat miniatures system in the works as a supplement, but the project was stillborne. Decipher was notoriously bad for supporting the Trek RPG.

Heck, I myself have written (and gotten "published") more adventure material for them by at least an order of magnitude.

I love the Starship system - loose and abstract is exactly what I'm looking for. But, I wish Decipher had been able to publish some of their promised character-based material: Klingons, The Peacekeepers, and Worlds in book-form would have added a lot to the game !

Selek - I'd love to get a look at those adventures !

Tomcat - congratulations on the birth of your daughter. You've got a long, and very rewarding road ahead of you. Mine's 9 now. I downloaded your house-rule. It's going to get a ton of use ! Thanks, so much.

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Originally Posted by selek

Heck, I myself have written (and gotten "published") more adventure material for them by at least an order of magnitude.

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Well, it's been, what, a decade since the last supplement came out?

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Originally Posted by Fugazi Grrl

Tomcat - congratulations on the birth of your daughter. You've got a long, and very rewarding road ahead of you. Mine's 9 now. I downloaded your house-rule. It's going to get a ton of use ! Thanks, so much.

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Thanks, FG! She is number 4, so I have been reaping the rewards for the last 17 years now! ;)

I also forgot that some adjustments were made to the Sensor Rules, and I added targeting modifiers for Size, plus rate of fire rules. They can found here if anyone is interested:

https://rpg.avioc.org/boards/index.p...6.html#msg4206

But then we discussed the Size mods here:

http://forum.trek-rpg.net/showthread.php?t=15262

So, read through and take what you want, if you want. :)

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Originally Posted by selek

The CODA combat system is designed to be abstract in order to facilitate "theatrical" combat. It was never intended as a detailed "simulation" system (such as Star Fleet Battles or Harpoon).

The starship construction (and combat) rules group the weapons into batteries by type.

The listed damage is for a single salvo from that weapons group.

Using the example you gave from the Defiant Class: Type 1 Pulse Phasers (x4 D) 6/5/5/0

A single salvo from all four phasers would do 6 points of damage at Point Blank range, and 5 points at Short and Medium ranges.

A salvo from her quantum torpedoes would do 4 points of damage at all ranges.



To make things even more abstract, the "number of weapons" aboard a ship is essentially a guesstimate (usually about half) of how many weapons will bear on the target at any given moment, rather than those "officially" listed on the "actual" vessel.

The Galaxy Class (pg 148) is listed as having five (six, if you count the concealed weapon) phasers.

The Next Generation Tech Manual lists ten separate banks- and the "uprated" vessels in the DS9 Tech Manual have more still.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

There was (allegedly) a detailed starship combat miniatures system in the works as a supplement, but the project was stillborne. Decipher was notoriously bad for supporting the Trek RPG.

Heck, I myself have written (and gotten "published") more adventure material for them by at least an order of magnitude.

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hey there thanks for responding okay so one more clarification then i stop bein a pain in the butt so what your saying is ..... no matter how many of that wepon there is ....reguardless if there was 1 of that weapon or 4 .. it still does pen value of what that 1 mark 1 pulse phaser does which is 6/5/5/0 and there is no multiplication of that pen due to how many cannons there are is that correct?...do i have it right?


i really appreciate the explanation and the responses for me...... thank you all very much for answering my questions
sorry to be a pain

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Originally Posted by Korga

hey there thanks for responding okay so one more clarification then i stop bein a pain in the butt

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First and foremost, unless you break out in the Klingon version of "Gangnam style" or random political/religious rant #384, you're not being a pain.

Answering questions and sharing insights is why the boards exist.

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so what your saying is ..... no matter how many of that wepon there is ....reguardless if there was 1 of that weapon or 4 .. it still does pen value of what that 1 mark 1 pulse phaser does which is 6/5/5/0 and there is no multiplication of that pen due to how many cannons there are is that correct?...do i have it right?

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Yes.....and no. Penetration is calculated from the firepower of the entire battery.

If you look at Table 9.10 Beam Weapon Costs on pg 140 of the Narrator's Guide, each weapon has a listed Offense Value. The Type One Pulse phaser has an OV of 11.

Four of them in battery gives you a Total OV of 44.

You then switch over to Table 9.12 Beam and Missile Weapons (pg 142 of the Narrator's Guide).

You'll note that a Total OV of 35-44 gives beam weapons a Penetration of 6/5/5/0/0.

Logically, a single weapon from the battery would do less damage than the whole- but because the system is abstract, it doesn't follow a linear progression.

An OV of 11 (the value of a single Type 1 Pulse) still has a Penetration of 4/3/3/0/0.


There are two circumstances where you would need to consider how much damage a reduced weapons battery might affect damage: 1) story telling and 2) combat.

From the storytelling perspective, you can arbitrarily "step down" the damage based on your own judgement.

From a combat perspective, it's important to realize that the writers have already accounted for this in the damage system.

The way the system is written, the damage done by the weapons is heavily abstracted- but so is the damage received by the target.

If you look at the Table 7.10 System Damage chart on page 115, you'll note that you can damage various systems- but all damage to the weapons treated as a single category.

Rather than destroying a specific weapon mount, damage is being done to the entire weapons array. Instead of knocking out a single gun, damage is being done to their offensive capability as a whole.

Using the numbers above, knocking out a single pulse phaser cannon will reduce the phaser penetration from 6/5/5/0/0 to 5/5/4/0/0.

Using the damage system, checking off box "D" on the System Damage track (meaning Defiant's weapons have taken one bloc of damage) reduces the penetration of all arrays by 1.

The effect is the same, without having to stop and recalculate the math or worry about precisely where the shot landed and a lot of arguing about how many weapon mounts were in that particular hull section.

Again, this was done to both to speed up play and to simulate what we see on screen.

We never see Worf or Kira picking off a target ship's guns one-at-a-time. The order is always "Target their weapons array!".

One good salvo (and high dice roll) later, the enemy is disarmed.


To put it another way, most starship tactical simulators put you outside the ship looking down at the action (the ancient video games Asteroids and Defender were excellent examples of this). This system is designed to keep you in the cockpit (or on the bridge) for the action- just like most modern flight simulators.

The idea was to concentrate more on what the characters are doing to defeat the enemy than what the ship was doing to the same end.

The emphasis is one cinematic action and storytelling, rather than on precision mathematics and (often contradictory) blueprints and schematics.

ohhh I gota ya .. Thanks so much for the help i think i understand now .. thanks for taking the time to explain it to me

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Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King

Well, it's been, what, a decade since the last supplement came out?

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Yikes. Has it really been that long?

Ye gods I must be getting old.

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Originally Posted by Fugazi Grrl

Selek - I'd love to get a look at those adventures !

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Most everything that's "presentable" is listed at Patrick's BTFF page. As my schedule permits, I'll be polishing and adding more material.

In addition to cramming (I need to watch 74 more episodes of Voyager in the next ten days or so) for a 7th Fleet Command test, I'm also running seven RPG sessions per month and looking for gainful employment at the same time.

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Tomcat - congratulations on the birth of your daughter. You've got a long, and very rewarding road ahead of you. Mine's 9 now. I downloaded your house-rule. It's going to get a ton of use ! Thanks, so much.

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I want to echo this. I have four girls. My oldest just came back from a mission in the Phillipines (I have no idea why I don't yet have grey hair), and my second oldest leaves for a mission in Fort Lauderdale Florida in February.

My youngest just got her learner's permit- but I wouldn't trade it for the world- or the galaxy. I miss having them small enough to cuddle and rock.

Such good times you have in store.

I'm genuinely honoured to be in the presence of two experienced dads. When my daughter reaches those critical ages, I may be asking you guys for more than just gaming tips.

In the meantime I do have one for you -

The "target system" thing brought it to mind.

Unless I'm mistaken, the rules say that when a ship successfully targets a system on another vessel it does damage to that system equal to 1 point for every 3 points of penetration over the threshold.

Does this mean if the Enterprise-D is targeting the disruptor-arrays of a D'Deridex class Warbird, and Worf manages to score a success to target the system the Enterprise can't really do any damage to a D'Deridex's systems ?

The highest penetration for the Galaxy Class is 6 at PB range - and the D'Deridex's threshold is 4. The Galaxy class' penetration isn't as high as 3 over the threshold.

Maybe we've been interpreting the rule wrong. But what we've been doing is applying the full, scored damage to the system's damage track if the tactical officer rolls high enough to hit the system. Makes it easier for a weapons officer to follow the order - "Target shields and weapons, only."

How do you guys handle this ?

Just wanted to note that my son and I watched all of the portions of DS9 that dealt with the Dominion War.

It was interesting during the final conflict - when you had massive fleets squaring off against each other - you often had a single shot (or two) wiping out entire starships!

That is, unless they were ones with main characters (PCs) on them! :D

Doug, I'm finally getting the rest of DS9 on DVD for Christmas. Including all the Dominion War episodes. So, I'm going to have to have a similar marathon before year's end.

Maybe there should be a new Starship trait that gives the PC's vessel some kind of special "hand of fate" type protection in mass-battles.

Riker - "Fate. Protects fools. Little children. And ships called Enterprise".

That sounds like an excellent idea, FG! :)

I remember the FASA Trek game had some cool sheets representing "consoles" for each of the main bridge officers to use during combat that tracked power, damage and modifiers. Has anybody made something like this for Coda Trek?