One Small Ship...

No, not a shrunken ship - I'm thinking of something like a Berlin Class Security Cutter... crew of 12. Or something similar - where there are very few crew, small ship, not a huge range of capabilities.

Has anyone tried to run a game this way? Something bigger than a runabout, but say only size 3 or so.

I'm thinking it would be interesting - since for sure you'd have the "lt. Commander as a captain" scenerio (or even lieutenant), since certainly Starfleet can't have a captain for every single security cutter out there...

The Doc

You could try playing on an Oberth class scout. That´s the class seen in Star Trek II which was blown up by the Klingons. It has a crew of 20.

There´s also an Oberth class surveyor seen in TNG with a crew of 80. You´ll find it´s statistics in the TNG-LUG-book and also in the SRM1.

I think most of the statistics can be used unchanged for the smaller version.

Playing on the smaller version is also great because there are some excellent deckplans available, made by Owen E. Oulten.
Maybe someone else knows where you can download them.

I hope this will help you.

Tried it once...we used a Rigel-class scout, crew of about 40 plus...it was like one of those WWII submarine movies. Small crew working in a very small ship...it was a good starting point for a new group as it'll teach them to work together.

With regard to CO rank, I think that any ship smaller than size 6 should be commanded by a Commander...and anything under 4 just needs an senior officer (lieutenant or lieutenant(jg))...just remember except for shuttles and runabouts any ship CO is still called "Captain" regardless of rank.

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Originally posted by Ergi

There´s also an Oberth class surveyor seen in TNG with a crew of 80. You´ll find it´s statistics in the TNG-LUG-book and also in the SRM1.

I think most of the statistics can be used unchanged for the smaller version.

Playing on the smaller version is also great because there are some excellent deckplans available, made by Steve Long.
Maybe someone else knows where you can download them.

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I've been using an Oberth (80 crew) for my PBEM game, and liking it. I just wanted to try something smaller than that, where the majority of the crew are PCs.. :)

The Doc

The game I'm currently in (as a player) is on a very small Klingon Bird of Prey (don't remember the name of the class - it's the smallest one) during the Dominion War. It's working very well. We've got a couple of Starfleet characters whose own ship was destroyed who are on loan to the Klingons. The acting captain was originally the security officer. She'd discovered that the original captain had been replaced by a shapeshifter, then challenged and killed him (along with the first officer, who'd refused to challenge the fake captain himself).

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Originally posted by LizardQueen
The game I'm currently in (as a player) is on a very small Klingon Bird of Prey (don't remember the name of the class - it's the smallest one) during the Dominion War. It's working very well. We've got a couple of Starfleet characters whose own ship was destroyed who are on loan to the Klingons. The acting captain was originally the security officer. She'd discovered that the original captain had been replaced by a shapeshifter, then challenged and killed him (along with the first officer, who'd refused to challenge the fake captain himself).

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That sounds like a great campaign setting. :) I'm thinking of using the aforementioned Berlin Class once my campaign gets into high-gear - I'm going to place a few alternate player characters on one of them doing a security run, and have them come home to find that their home base has been destroyed, and they're on their own and now behind Dominion lines...

Ultimately, I'll have that alternate ship and the players' regular ship hook up, likely with the little Berlin-class ship racing in to the rescue of the Perseus (Nebula class ship) somehow at a critical time... and finally being reunited with the rest of starfleet after a long time behind the lines.

I figure I can staff the Berlin with 15 officers, instead of the usual mix of officers and non-com - I figure ships that small would be assigned to run between starbases, or to run on a loop "security course" around a border or sector on a regular basis, but to be under the command of a station or starbase or planet...

Now - to staff a small ship like that..? 15 Officers, so... A full lieutenant (command) in charge, and since it's a security ship, maybe a lieutenang JG Tactical/Security... Pilot Ensign... Ops Ensign... Hrm... thoughts, people? :)

The Doc

I am not familiar with the Berlin -class. Is it a personal design? What are the stats?

Hum. . .a crew of 15 on what so far sounds like a cutter. How about this for crew:

Lieut. Cmder as the captian
Lieutenant as first officer
Lieut. j.g or Ens. at ops
Lieut. j.g or Ens. at helm

Lieutenant as chief engineer
Lieut. j.g. as assistant engineer
Ens. as engineering officer
Ens. as engineering officer
Ens. as engineering officer

Lieutenant as chief security/tac. officer
Leiut. j.g or Ens. as security officer
Leiut. j.g or Ens. as security officer

Lieutentant as cheif medical officer
Lieut. j.g. or Ens. as nurse

Lieutenant or Lieut. j.g. as science officer


You might want to take away from the engineering and add to the security/tac department if you plan on doing many boarding parties. ;)

Hope this helps; and how about some ship stats?

Thanks for your list of crewmen - I think I would switch around some of the engineers into ops (though that's close to the usual)... Since on a regular security type ship (Escourt) the mix is 12% Command (1.8, or 2 officers), 20% Engineering (3 officers), Ditto for Operations (3 officers), 33% Security (4.95, or 5 officers), 10% Medical (1.5, so in this case, I'd go with 1 officer), 5% Science (0.75, or 1 officer). Given that:

Command:
"Captain" (Lt. Cmdr)
XO (Lt.)

Engineering:
"Chief" (Lt. JG)
Ensign
Ensign

Operations:
"Chief" (Lt. JG)
Ensign
Ensign

Security:
"Chief" (Lieutenant)
Lieutenant JG
Ensign
Ensign
Ensign

Medical:
Ensign or Lieutenant JG

Science:
Ensign

Now, all that said - would a little ship like that really need the science officer and medical officer? I'm thinking that if it really is based off a starbase, then sure, they could send a lower-ranked science and medical officer along to be "just in case" type people - which will make the adventure series more interesting once it begins....

The Berlin Class is a Security Cutter from the ICON-links addition to the Rogues book - I imagine you can get it at the TrekRPG site, but it's a little ship:

Size 3, 4 decks, Max warp of 9.0 (for 6 hours), no torpedoes just phasers (though I imagine, like Runabouts, microtorps are possible with a little bit of refit)...

http://www.trekrpg.net/trek/core/ico..._Icon_Link.pdf is where its at, page 10, one of two Security ships. The other one is even smaller, and is a two crew job. :)

The Doc

Why is the whole crew made up of officers? The bulk of any starship crew should be enlisted personnel and with 15 bodies, I'd say 2 officers are required max, a CO and an XO. Chiefs can fill most of the other key slots with a few enlisted ratings to do the grunt work...I know Star Trek gives the impression that everyone on the ship is an officer, its a fallacy which has never been addressed but you can't spare 15 officers to run one small security vessel, its a waste of resources.

LQ: you're thinking of the B'Rel -class scout.

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Originally posted by Michael Barratt

Now, all that said - would a little ship like that really need the science officer and medical officer? I'm thinking that if it really is based off a starbase, then sure, they could send a lower-ranked science and medical officer along to be "just in case" type people - which will make the adventure series more interesting once it begins....

http://www.trekrpg.net/trek/core/ico..._Icon_Link.pdf is where its at, page 10, one of two Security ships. The other one is even smaller, and is a two crew job.

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Thanks for the link! Forgot all about those pages. :o

As for a science/medical officer for such a small ship. Probably not for the medical officer. . .if the ship stayes close to a "home port." If it tends to stray from its home then it would propably be a good idea. A cutter could end up in a lot of trouble. . . and you would not want to get caught too far from home without a surgeon if you just got into a tiff with a prirate or two.

As for the science officer. . .I have to say every starfleet ship, no matter the size should have one. The main purpose of starfleet is exploration and in the off chance that even a small non-capital ship like a Berlin -class could run into something worth exploring would justify the one science officer. Granted there will be few opportunites for steady work for s/he or it. But the very nature of starfleet would demand it in my opinion.

To Ghostly. . .

I too like to add enlisted and Noncoms into my games. But I believe he asked for Officer grade personnel only. Thus that is what I provided. ;)

I started my campaign on a Nova Class, the USS Farscape...let me say that it was fun, but they got tired of running all the time...and let me tell you, hat is just what they did.

I am all for these ships, but it does impose certain limits on the type of game you can run.

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Originally posted by ghosty
Why is the whole crew made up of officers? The bulk of any starship crew should be enlisted personnel and with 15 bodies, I'd say 2 officers are required max, a CO and an XO. Chiefs can fill most of the other key slots with a few enlisted ratings to do the grunt work...I know Star Trek gives the impression that everyone on the ship is an officer, its a fallacy which has never been addressed but you can't spare 15 officers to run one small security vessel, its a waste of resources.

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I did it on purpose since I'm slaving the ship to a starbase/planet... I figure, like the Runabouts in DS9, most often you end up with the officers taking the things out. Even thought hey had O'Brien with them a lot...

That said, I could see the Tac department drop a notch, and maybe Engineering: One Ensign leading the group, everyone else non-com...

Normally, for a security/escourt vessell, it's a 28%/72% split of officers to enlisted, so that'd mean four officers... Let me try it that way...

Commanded by a Lieutenant Commander (Command Officer)
XO of a Lieutenant (Command Officer)
Tactical/Security of a Lieutenant JG or Ensign (Security Officer)
And either an Ops Officer or Chief Engineer (Ensign)

The other 11 staff would be Non-Coms that way. A pilot, either the chief Engineer or chief of Ops, a science specialist, a medical specialist (this makes more sense than a medical doctor, actually, the equivalent of a paramedic in cases of emergency), four security, two engineering, one operations.

Thoughts?

The Doc (graduated. ;) )

A lieutenant commander to ride herd over 15 people? A bit much in my view unless he also commands the cutter squadron.

A ship this size can make do with a Lieutenant in command (much like PT boats and other patrol craft). A lieutenant commander has more important duties such as heading a department on a capital ship or executive officer on a scout or small frigate...don't waste officers unless you're giving them a command consumate to their rank. Remember a department head on a galaxy-class ship would have more than 100 people under his command.

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Originally posted by ghosty
A lieutenant commander to ride herd over 15 people? A bit much in my view unless he also commands the cutter squadron.

A ship this size can make do with a Lieutenant in command (much like PT boats and other patrol craft). A lieutenant commander has more important duties such as heading a department on a capital ship or executive officer on a scout or small frigate...don't waste officers unless you're giving them a command consumate to their rank. Remember a department head on a galaxy-class ship would have more than 100 people under his command.

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That was my original idea, actually. Which would leave the command officers at a full lieutenant and a JG Lieutenant XO.

I more or less want to make this small ship with lower-ranked officers (and maybe Non-Coms, still can't decide) to strand them behind enemy lines for a while in a ship that isn't really up to snuff for that situation. This is a security ship used to track and maybe take on pirates and the like - it's sort of like the "cop car" of Starfleet, patrolling through areas that are high-risk for criminal activity...

The Doc

Another thing I forgot to mention is that the CO and XO can also take on double duties at the helm, tactical or ops as the ship is small enough for them to be able to pull more than one job at action stations. On PT boats the skipper usually manned the helm in action.

Okay, he's my final draft (barring whatever awareness might impend) on the crew of said Security Cutter:

Lieutenant (Command Branch) - the "Captain"
Lieutenant JG (Command Branch) - the Executive Officer
Lieutenant JG (Security Path) - the Chief of Security/Tactical
Ensign (Engineering) - the Chief Engineer
Ensign (Operations) - the Chief of Operations

Two enlisted Engineers round out the Engineering Staff,
Four enlisted Security crewmen round out the Security Staff,
Two enlister Operations crewmen round out the Ops Staff,
One enlisted science crewman,
One enlisted medical crewman (specifically trained in emergency medicine).

Even though that's a 1:2 ratio for officers:enlisted, I figure it's about right. The Lt JG Command would be a "floater" - trained in, say, Ops and Conn as well as being the XO so that he can take other stations even when he has the bridge (ditto for the 'captain' too). Pilots and alternate ops station crewmen would likewise be trained... I can certainly see the science specialist taking a turn at Ops - he already has the sensors skill and it wouldn't take much to give him a specialization in the Ops Management side of Shipboard Systems.

So that's how I'm gonna staff my little bitty ship.. (well, my 4-deck small ship)...

The Doc

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Originally posted by Michael Barratt
Lieutenant (Command Branch) - the "Captain"
Lieutenant JG (Command Branch) - the Executive Officer
Lieutenant JG (Security Path) - the Chief of Security/Tactical
Ensign (Engineering) - the Chief Engineer
Ensign (Operations) - the Chief of Operations

Two enlisted Engineers round out the Engineering Staff,
Four enlisted Security crewmen round out the Security Staff,
Two enlister Operations crewmen round out the Ops Staff,
One enlisted science crewman,
One enlisted medical crewman (specifically trained in emergency medicine).

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Since I'm an idiot and can't read, I now point out that the crew listing for the Berlin Class Security Cutter is 12, not 15. *sigh* So, axe out one of the security crewmen, one of the ops crewmen and one of the engineer crewmen. This is not a ship that's really capable of very long-term missions, methinks - with only 12 people, keeping going throughout the day on a 3-shift rotation would have only 4 people going at any time...

Major multitasking...

The Doc

Just want to say that my tabletop game met and since a player couldn't make it, I jumped ahead and used the security cutter, the USS Sam Steele (like I said, we were a little "on the fly," LOL). They made up the officers as I posted last (modified to the 12 total, and one chose to be the medical non-com). Was pretty damn cool.

The simple scenerio was set a little ahead from our usual timeframe: in-game, we're just about at the outbreak of the Dominion War, and we jumped ahead into the beginnings of said war.

The cutter took a partrol route, got a bit surprised by a Jem'Hadar scouting ship making contact with a frontier region/borderline criminal area, and when they retreated back to the starbase to report - they found floating rubble, and realized they were behind enemy lines. They high-tailed it to a nebula (whoever said it above, you're right, a lot of running), and managed to hide their buts. Then, since Jem'Hadar were still coming, they came up with a pretty neat plan.

The Jem'Hadar found them in orbit of the starbase debris, searching for survivors. A trio of Jem'Hadar then chased them, fought with them, and the Sam Steele made it into the Nebula again, where sensors were crap, as were targetting systems. There, the Jem'Hadar fired a lot, and ended up blowing up the ship and leaving...

Or so they thought. The players filled the the Sam Steele with bits from the starbase, which they them dumped out of the cargo bay in the nebula, ignited a charge, and made it look like they'd been blown up.

They're psyched about meeting up with that ship agian sometime. :)

So - small ships get my yay vote! :cool:

The Doc

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Originally Posted by Michael Barratt

http://www.trekrpg.net/trek/core/ico..._Icon_Link.pdf is where its at, page 10, one of two Security ships. The other one is even smaller, and is a two crew job. :)

The Doc

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Link rot has killed this, does anyone out there have the ICON stats for this ship, an image?

This link should work a bit better :)

http://www.trek-rpg.net/oldsite/core..._Icon_Link.pdf

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Originally Posted by Cpt. Lundgren

This link should work a bit better :)

http://www.trek-rpg.net/oldsite/core..._Icon_Link.pdf

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Thanks, that is exactly what I needed!

As for images of the Berlin Class I would take a leaf out of the Trek production playbook. Find yourself a non starfleet ship (or not obvious origins) and rename, alter the size , maybe invert it?

Could even vbe an obvious Federation ship too. Heres a nice one;
http://johneaves.files.wordpress.com...pg?w=655&h=338

Quite like this too, which has a bit more of a hero ship feel about it, and less Starfleet type.
http://trekazoid.files.wordpress.com...rsp_screen.png
and other views of that last one;
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-h....jpg+large.jpg

Here is two more: The second pic is the one that I would use for the Berlin;
Note: Both of these pics are taken fron Starship Schematics Database.
Here is a link to that site: http://www.shipschematics.net/

Thanks, I had forgotten about that site.
I was looking at the Tomahawk & the tsyklon

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Originally Posted by JALU3

the tsyklon

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That's just a Steamrunner with the a Sabre bottom...

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Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King

That's just a Steamrunner with the a Sabre bottom...

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Looking at it, it is. Another problem is that it has a partially embedded nacelles, something that the Berlin Security Cutter doesn't have.

EAS's Fabrux class has a certain Sternbachian severity to its design.

Others I'd consider for the Berlin:
Vladivostok
Mosquito
Trident

You could also do what the show would do to save on production budgets and just declare the Berlin to be a Raven-type spaceframe with more weapons onboard.

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Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King

You could also do what the show would do to save on production budgets and just declare the Berlin to be a Raven-type spaceframe with more weapons onboard.

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That was my firsrt thought as well TK, especially as they have similar dimensions and you have the deckplans available with minor tweaking it would really work I think. My take on the coda Berlin can be found here. http://forum.trek-rpg.net/showthread.php?t=16655

I have been quite tempted to run a small ship campaign within Orion space (as per the FASA sourcebooks) - probably a FASA Ranger class Scout. The ship would be within Merchant Marine Command and act as a customs/safety cutter for UFP registered ships within the Rigel system and beyond. The FASA sourcebook says that StarFleet picket ships can orbit Rigel II as part of the agreement.

A StarFleet/Traveller type campaign would ensue. Maybe even have the PC's as just one of the two shuttle based Inspection teams and have an NPC Captain and 1st Officer.

Also Owen Oulton has a great set of Ranger class plans on his blog which are really helpful!

Yep, I'm very happy with the way the plans came out and hope others enjoy using them in their games. The Ranger class is one of my favourite FASA designs.

Here's the link: http://www.coldnorth.com/owen/deckpl...nger/index.htm

That seems like a really high crew compliment for a ship that size and with that mission—is the figure from the FASA books?

Yep, it is. Look at Deck 2 and you can see that it has enough bunk space for the crew in double cabins.

And, with all due respect and praise to Owen, it is a well designed set of plans and an inspired reimaging of the FASA design - IMHO an ideal small ship.

With a reasonable crew compliment and two (very jammed in) shuttlecratft, it can be used as anything from a true scout exploration of "strange new worlds", to a courier, to a police cutter, to ( as I am using) a customs cutter, picketing the Rigel system, and conducting customs inspections and safety checks on UFP registered merchants.

The FASA Orions supplement says that StarFleet ships are (as you would expect) kept to very strict flight paths in Rigel Space. And so I imagine the ship kept in orbit around Rigel II (the one planet in that system they are permitted to orbit) while Inspection Teams in the two shuttles range around the system conducting the actual inspections. With the mothership ranging further afield should there be a need.

For this the Ranger is perfect.

Hey everyone. First post. New to the forums here.

Now that that's out of the way, I would like to share what I'm doing for my "One Small Ship" campaign I'm running. Has anybody here read the Star Trek Vanguard or Seekers novels? They feature a tiny Archer-class scout ship called the USS Sagittarius. In my campaign, my crew are also flying an Archer-class scout ship called the USS Artemis. It has a crew complement of 14 with tight living conditions, not heavily armed, but very fast and stealthy. This feels perfect for TOS-era campaigns.
http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Archer_class