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I'm in need of stats for some disparate equipment in my upcoming campaign.
To wit: the "isolation suits" from Insurrection (don't know why they weren't in The Price of Freedom) and a gunpowder-based pistol of some kind (my players are off to a primitive planet.)
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"Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand." -Anon.
I think the Player's Guide has the isolation suit. The TOS core book has the flintlock rifle. Holodeck adventures has many types of gunpowder guns - tommyguns and pistols for the film noir genre and lots of primitive musket types for the pirate genre.
The guy who wrote up ICON ALIENS had several advanced gunpowder weapons written up at http://home.austin.rr.com/jdominion/...ns/weapons.htm
Well, the Colonial Marines these people are not. Sure makes me wish I could get hold of some of these books...
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"Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand." -Anon.
After seeing that the Borg couldn't adapt to projectiles like they could energy weapons, y'ever wonder why Starfleet didn't start equipping every ship's armory with at least a few assault rifles? =)
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"You got your Star Trek Trek in my roleplaying game!"
"You got your roleplaying game in my Star Trek!"
LUGTrek, two great tastes that taste great together
I started thinking about it right after the scene in FC.
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In the Praetors Name!
In my campaign, they have begun to adopt Gauss weapons. Fundamentally, magnetic slug throwers. They work rather well...
but wait 'til the Borg start neutralizing local magnetic fields. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/wink.gif
maybe the flintlock isn't such a bad idea.
-R
whoops! double post...
Really Don, I *swear*!!!
I'm NOT board spamming....
http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/biggrin.gif
-R
[This message has been edited by Roxby (edited 08-07-2001).]
That's why the good old fashioned lead ball propelled by a chemical explosion still seems best.
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In the Praetors Name!
heh, all this bullets vs. Borg talk made me think of Ewoks wiping out Stormtroopers, which made me think of Ewoks beating off the Borg.
Must be the medication.
What level of weapons tech do these people have? Gunpowder firearms have been going through constant change for the past few hundred years, from medieval hand cannons to state of the art assault rifles. Basically you start with hand cannons (a metal tube attached to a stick, loaded with powder and shot and fired by touching a lit bit of match to the "touch hole and boom!), then you have your basic matchlocks and wheellocks(the early muskets), then the flintlock (Brown Bess muskets, Kentucky rifles), then the percussion lock (like a flint lock but uses a "cap" to set off charge instead of steel striking flint, these include the Springfield rifle-musket and cap-and-ball revolvers), then we get to early cartridge weapons (Henry rifles and "Yellow Boys), then we wind up in the modern "smokeless powder" age, OK lecture over... any questions?
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"Retreat?! Hell, we just got here!"
[This message has been edited by Antonsb214 (edited 08-07-2001).]
Amen, brother! Assimilate this, mo-fo!Quote:
Originally posted by Phantom:
That's why the good old fashioned lead ball propelled by a chemical explosion still seems best.
Hey, the ewoks would kick Borg ass...just their sheer cute, cuddly marketability would make them run for the next galaxy over.Quote:
Originally posted by Brian K:
heh, all this bullets vs. Borg talk made me think of Ewoks wiping out Stormtroopers, which made me think of Ewoks beating off the Borg.
Must be the medication.
Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition. Blow 'em apart and let the queen sort 'em out. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/biggrin.gifQuote:
Originally posted by qerlin:
Amen, brother! Assimilate this, mo-fo!
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In the Praetors Name!
To the Venture players.
Dont expect this to work... For some reason the collective has adapted to projectile weapons...
Its called armour and shields... hey if a deflector shield can stop micro-metereorites, and the Borg have deflectors... So the adaption technology is there...
My own personal take on FC was that the energy matrix of the holographic bullets was what got the borg, if another drone had shown up Picard would have been up a certain geographic anomaly without a method of propulsion...
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DanG.
"Hi, I'm Commander Troy McClure, you might remember me from other academy training holo-simulations as, Abandon Ship, the quickest way out, and I sense danger, 101 things you dont need a Betazoid to know..."
http://www.theventure.freeserve.co.uk
In First Contact, it wasn't so much that the Borg were vulnerable to bullets, but that they were vulnerable to HOLOGRAPHIC bullets. I'm sure the Borg have encountered bullets before, and could adapt to them. But that scene may well have been the first time they were shot by holographic bullets. I was really impressed by Picard's ingenuety in that scene.
I can only wonder why the Borg are so vulnerable to unpowered melee weapons, like those klingon blades Worf used. I can only hypothesize that since the Borg could use their assimilation tubes in close combat, they did not fear melee weapons. And thus shielding against that was not worth the resources it would take.
My theory about their lack of immunity to melee weapons is simple.
No two punches are identical... different size bodies, changes in muscle will mean that in hand to hand the same attack is never thrown twice... Where as energy weapons have a frequency and firearms have a velocity and calibre that can be adapted to over time...
Just a theory...
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DanG.
"Hi, I'm Commander Troy McClure, you might remember me from other academy training holo-simulations as, Abandon Ship, the quickest way out, and I sense danger, 101 things you dont need a Betazoid to know..."
http://www.theventure.freeserve.co.uk
It's a velocity matter.
The navigational deflector of a star ship deflects matter out of the way that's moving to fast to dodge.
The borg deflector screens do the same. The high velocity particle (lead bullet) is deflected by the same technology.
I'm not an expert in weapons physics, but I don't imagine that a Bat'leth strike is traveling any where near the same speed as a bullet.
The Bat'leth comes in too slow for the deflectors to compensate. The theory is "Any thing that slow, we should be able to dodge, or it won't have enough energy to damage us anyways."
Kind of like in Dune with the force fields. If you went slow enough, you could get through. It just happens that the Borg shields have that threshold much higher. Of cource, that could be a side effect of "Doesn't blow up when hit by weapons fire". http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/wink.gif
Just my 2 cred.
Alex
First Contact goes to show you what happens when you catch the Borg unawares.The fact that a borg was easily knocked off by a tommygun of circa WW2 tells me that they haven't run into a race that uses these weapons,otherwise their shields would have stopped the bullets. http://www.trekrpg.net/Board/ubb/biggrin.gif
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Best speed to Gallifrey!
Commodore Horatio Richard Jaeger,CO
USS Audacity, NCC-85901
No, Commodore. It tells us they haven't met any race that uses holographic bullets. BIG difference in terms of uniqueness.
Well, anyway, the primitives in my story have about a mid-20th-century level of technology. Additionally, one of my players wants to be a collector of antique weapons (actually he originally wanted to carry around a .45 "in case of electrical problems with my phaser," but I wouldn't let him.)
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"Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand." -Anon.
Ok, along the line of the post (yet still thinking Borg) why hasn't Starfleet started using bayonets, I think every other government's solder has some form of melee weapon on them.
Just a thought...
Phoenix...
I think the lack of Bayonets has more to do with Starfleets adoption of the 'Evolved' principles of Humanity in the Trek Universe...
The Phaser is a tool with settings ranging from 'Sun Tan' through to 'Blow up a Mountain'... But most often it is automatically set to stun.
Even when its set on kill, the death is relatively quick and painless when compared to Disruptors of the Jem'Hadar energy weapons.
Ask any soldier, this board is full of them, a major weapon of war is injury. Bullets, fragmentation explosions and bayonets are all designed to kill and main. But in injuring the enemy it is hoped that the injury will spark a chain reaction that will tie up resources and personnel dealing with the injury, lower morale to see comrades carried off... And possibly more.
All pshycological warfare.
However the Federation prides itself on its humanitarian principles, and causing unessesary pain is against those principles... Even if it does add another weapon to your arsenal.
This does not however mean that the absence in the field is unoticed. Watch DS9 'The Siege of AR-558', one of the troops is clearly seen carrying a knife, and even seen fighting Jem'Hadar with it, Hand to Hand.
However, what is also clearly seen, is that at the end of the episode, this is one of the surviving characters, and just before beam-out, and a return to civilisation for this character, he throws the knife away.
This one episode covers your query about bayonets completely, without a single word said about them...
At least, its all IMO, someone might have a different view...
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DanG.
"Hi, I'm Commander Troy McClure, you might remember me from other academy training holo-simulations as, Abandon Ship, the quickest way out, and I sense danger, 101 things you dont need a Betazoid to know..."
http://www.theventure.freeserve.co.uk
Yes, one. Who do I have to contact for becoming a member of the NRA?Quote:
Originally posted by Antonsb214:
What level of weapons tech do these people have? Gunpowder firearms have been going through constant change for the past few hundred years, from medieval hand cannons to state of the art assault rifles. Basically you start with hand cannons (a metal tube attached to a stick, loaded with powder and shot and fired by touching a lit bit of match to the "touch hole and boom!), then you have your basic matchlocks and wheellocks(the early muskets), then the flintlock (Brown Bess muskets, Kentucky rifles), then the percussion lock (like a flint lock but uses a "cap" to set off charge instead of steel striking flint, these include the Springfield rifle-musket and cap-and-ball revolvers), then we get to early cartridge weapons (Henry rifles and "Yellow Boys), then we wind up in the modern "smokeless powder" age, OK lecture over...
any questions?
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God, I liked him better before he died.
Well if it is a velocity factor and they did adapt shields for the projectiles because they were going faster than the speed of sound which is where most of a bullets destructive power comes from then why not make the powder weapons fire at slighly sub sonic speeds!! That would then negate the deflector theory!! They would have to have permanent shielding then which is both expensive (not that it matters to the Borg) and is also a big drain on energy! I doubt they would be able to carry a power source like that and still be effective!! That's just a idea from a mad mind and my 2 bucks worth!!
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Lt Marcus Kavart
Late USS Vengence
Incidentally, I ran the first session of this series on Friday the 17th, and our primitive weapons expert/helmsman did manage to use the native's guns against them (Prime Directive issues to be addressed later--the aliens found out the Away Team desipte their precautions.)
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"Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand." -Anon.
Standard issue .45 ACP ammunition is subsonic. It's primary damage is done by a large bulltet hitting the target and expending all or most of its energy inside the target. High velocity rounds (9mm and rifle ammo) generally go too fast and punch throught a target. Shot placement is a little more critical with smaller projectiles. But a discussion of velocity and penetration factors could take up a whole page.
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"Retreat?! Hell, we just got here!"