Do we even need Decipher anymore?

[REG]

Originally posted by 7 of 11

....do we still need Decipher anymore?

Hmm.

It would be nice if Decipher would get the material edited and layout finished for the printers to print and distribute so that there will be new products out by this summer 2004. It would be nice if they show the same aggressive, proactive approach to marketing RPG wares as they do with CCG wares. It would be nice...

But I agree with many here who says, "No, we don't need Decipher to publish Star Trek and LOTR RPGs."

But here is a question I would like to pose to Decipher: Do you need us -- RPG enthusiasts, fans of ST and LOTR -- and our money?

[Ineti]

Originally posted by Space_Cadet
Other than netbooks or fan made sourcebooks, I think more Coda-Trek related websites are needed or even better, a webring that links all the Coda Trek websites.

Are there other Coda Trek websites??

[Ineti]

Originally posted by REG
But here is a question I would like to pose to Decipher: Do you need us -- RPG enthusiasts, fans of ST and LOTR -- and our money?

Based on the lack of product over the last several months, and their lack of information about any new products, my guess would be no, they don't need us or our money.

[Mac417]

I gotta agree with Ineti and REG.

Plus as much income as their CCGs are feeding them, their RPG sales are probably a relative drop in the bucket anyways, IMHO.

--mac

[7 of 11]

.... is the last I heard (26 Sept-ish) that Worlds was at the printers? So was there a paper jam with no intern to unjam it, rejected by Paramount, ran out of print with no intern to go get some, last minute changes so they had to redo it (quality control perhaps?), or did we disrupt a timeline so all New Star Trek material had to be destroy to protect it? And to McBride and REG I asked that question to er..... try to get back on track because the last few posts felt a little like we got derailed. But thanks for the response! But I like what the Mac daddy had going on, not per episode but per season. History to look back on from the Series would be a great Narrator tool to build adventures out of and so forth. Note: They are throwing us a bone (a small one mind me) with the free downloadable adventures. I have e-mailed they with great praise everytime they do to show that I still have interest in the scraps that fall off the table. Here's hoping that helps in their efforts to *push* *squeeze* those last few books out. But one thing I'll never forgive them for, not the delays, deadlines past, down dated website, or losing our beloved JH (and that one hurt deeply) BUT for cancel the LE. Man that stinks!

7 of 11
A

[D.S.McBride]

Fair question: Does Decipher want us and our money? Yes they do. Most definitely. The problem is, they're not willing to put in the time/effort required to get it...at least as far as the RPGs are concerned.

As Don's indicated in other threads/forums, the Trek books did make Decipher money; no issue there. The problem was, they didn't make Decipher enough money; Decipher had gone into this little venture with the blue skies and candyland dreams of beating Wizards on their own turf, and controlling the gaming world on two fronts, CCG and RPG.

As just about anyone with a dash of sense could have told them, it wasn't likely to happen, especially straight out of the gate, and being johnny-come-latelies that they are in this game. As George Vasilakos (ex-LUG/Decipher Art Director) related on RPG.net, the Decipher RPG division was horribly mismanaged from the beginning, compounding the problem of whether or not the Trek and LotR games were going to set the pace for the Wizards' games to beat. If Decipher had taken it on a one-step-at-a-time basis, given the RPGs a while to prove themselves, carve out a niche in the market based on their dedication and hard work, and accepting the idea that doing good is good enough...well, things might have been different. As it is, I still believe, as I've stated before, that Decipher's RPG legacy is going to be as a cautionary tale and an industry joke about broken promises and wasted potential.

And yes, 7, I realize you did make your post as a way of getting this thread back on track: Much appreciated. The tone was getting distinctly unpleasant, and your post was the virtual dash of water in the face to get things back on track.

All right, enough ruminations. How about getting them PMs and plans starting to rumble?

[REG]

Originally posted by D.S.McBride

The problem was, they didn't make Decipher enough money; Decipher had gone into this little venture with the blue skies and candyland dreams of beating Wizards on their own turf, and controlling the gaming world on two fronts, CCG and RPG.

Of course, they didn't make enough money. I don't know what are their royalty payments with respect to Paramount and Tolkien Enterprises, but I'm guessing that after they took their share of the revenue, Decipher isn't making the kind of money they want to rival WotC, whose many RPG products are not someone else's properties (Star Wars being the exception).

In fact, I'm kinda waiting for them to acquire or create IP of their own. Maybe they should go buy out Fantasy Games Unlimited and start publishing Villains & Vigilantes as their own wares, or create an original RPG from inside the house. They should balance themselves out between being a licensee and a game publisher.

Curious but when was the last time Decipher ever produce a game of their own (in-house original, not a licensed brand)?

[D.S.McBride]

REG: Several good points there with respect to the number of licenses the two companies do and/or don't hold - I hadn't really thought about using this as a basis of comparison (understandably, I think, since I'm not into CCGs and the Trek and Star Wars RPGs are just about the only [currently published] ones I'm interested in).

With this in mind, I think that Decipher will have been stung badly enough by this whole experience that they'll swear off the RPGs for a good long time to come; probably, I would imagine, until if and when new management comes in with a fresh direction for the company and a slew of new RPG management ideas...like ones that actually work.

Re (all hail!) Villains & Vigilantes second ed., that game has achieved the rank of Not-To-Be-Touched in my family's hierarchy; after almost twenty years, we still consider it the single best superhero game on or off the market. If Decipher could, in fact, grab hold of it, and get Jack Herman and Jeff Dee in on the action, I'd gladly support it; in fact, I'd set up an armed camp around wherever those men work to make sure Decipher's fumble-fingers managers keep their grubby paws off the R and D process, and avoid the creative train-wreck we had with Trek and LotR.

A quick side note: Anyone checked out this City of Heroes game that's making the rounds? My youngest brother has become fricking addicted to the damn thing; looking at it, I swear the guys who put it together must have some vitamin V&V in their background.

[Sea Tyger]

Originally posted by D.S.McBride
A quick side note: Anyone checked out this City of Heroes game that's making the rounds? My youngest brother has become fricking addicted to the damn thing; looking at it, I swear the guys who put it together must have some vitamin V&V in their background.

"My name is Davy, and I'm a CoH addict..."

"Hi, Davy!"



I love that game. I think there's a thread in the General Chat about it. I think Don's addicted to it, too.

[D.S.McBride]

Originally posted by Sea Tyger
I think there's a thread in the General Chat about it. I think Don's addicted to it, too.

Where? For the love of God, where?!

I've scanned through the General Chat list, using Heightened Senses (Vision), and have been unable to locate said thread. Is it Enigma-coded, or has it been encased in a lead-lined subroutine in order to defeat my powers? Huh? Has it?

[Sea Tyger]

Originally posted by D.S.McBride
Where? For the love of God, where?!

I've scanned through the General Chat list, using Heightened Senses (Vision), and have been unable to locate said thread. Is it Enigma-coded, or has it been encased in a lead-lined subroutine in order to defeat my powers? Huh? Has it?

City of Heroes

I hope that helps.

I'm on Victory server.

[7 of 11]

.....heroes? I never can find anyone to play with.... May join that Victory sever with a new character. But back to the thread on hand.... Amazon.com is such a tease! They have so much cool stuff listed like the DS9 SB, and the ST TNG SB *sigh*

7 of 11
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[mattcolville]

Originally posted by TFVanguard
Then why the line drop when LUG was bought out? That's the main unanswered question that the whole issue really raises.

If that were REALLY the issue, then why did put forward that nonsense about Lucas? I think the issue really is; fans like you enjoy putting forth speculation couched in phrases that might trick the casual reader into thinking you had some knowledge or insight into the situation when, indeed, you're just guessing.

The history of what happened is pretty well known already. If you had questoins, why not ask them? Why make up crap?

Originally posted by TFVanguard
Then put this to bed and just say what happned, to the best of your ability.

Ok. Here's what happened:

I came here to see if there was any new discussion on the Decipher debacle and see if anyone had heard anything from them. I found someone who was offering baseless and wilfully ignorant speculation (you remember that Decipher had both the Trek and Star Wars CCG licenses, right?) about issues he seemed to have invented. This pisses me off, because I get upset when someone goes from the one fact they have ("I have no idea what happened behind the scenes") and decides to start rumors. I honestly don't know what you gain from this, though you're not the first person to do this.

I've already talked extensively about what happened behind the scenes at the companies I worked for. I don't get paid to do this and don't have any obligation to do it and after having done it several times, often to correct people who decide to lie about the issues, I get kinda sick of it.

[Sea Tyger]

Originally posted by 7 of 11
.....heroes? I never can find anyone to play with.... May join that Victory sever with a new character. But back to the thread on hand.... Amazon.com is such a tease! They have so much cool stuff listed like the DS9 SB, and the ST TNG SB *sigh*

7 of 11
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Please do.

Look for Celtic Cross, Justicar or Mercury Hg (better yet, just add them to your friends list ...those are my main characters on the server). I have three others, but those are my occasional distractions.

[TFVanguard]

Originally posted by mattcolville
[B]If that were REALLY the issue, then why did put forward that nonsense about Lucas? I think the issue really is; fans like you enjoy putting forth speculation couched in phrases that might trick the casual reader into thinking you had some knowledge or insight into the situation when, indeed, you're just guessing.

You're treading thin. I said explicitly what happened, that some individuals that I talked to, who don't usually steer me wrong, repeated something they had heard at the office. Period. I had no reason not to believe them.

That's a hell of a long way from being a liar or 'making shit up'. It's getting some dud info (perhaps), or just getting the wrong conclusion. It happens.

Your level of hostility, however, is simply unfair. Do you guys treat all people who might innocently get something wrong that way, or do you just shoot them?