Thoughts on an "average" Starfleet career.

[JALU3]

This would mean that the education to become a nurse is a subset of becoming a doctor. So a doctor wouldn't have any problem to apply for a nursing position of he wanted.

I know several nurses if they read this . . . that would be insulted by that statement.
There is a difference between nursing and medicine. People who practice medicine, I.E. Doctors and Medical Specialist (there is a reason why each have their own Corps within the Medical Regiment, approuch a patient far differently then someone who practices nursing or health care. Although it appears to be similar . . . when done correctly, it is far different in terms of the well being of a patient, and the patient benifits from these different approuches in the long run.

Now, in the Navy the enlisted rate is HM, and DT (which is now being rolled into HM). However, that does not mean that an HM knows all specialities and job skills of those specialties that are done by the subsets within that rate, yet they all wear the same insignia that is incorperated within their rank.

Here's a (not complete) list of possible medical positions that would need to be filled:
Officers:
Chief Medical Officer
Senior Medical Officer (basically just a higher ranking Medical Officer)
Medical Officer (or Medical Generalist, when compared to the next entry)
Medical Specialists: Here's a list of some: Anesthesiologist (anesthetic), Cardiologist (heart), Dermatologist (skin disorder), Epidemiologist (epidemic disease), Forensic/Coroner (cause of death), Gynecologist (female reproductive), Neurologist (nervous system), Neuro-Psychologist (brain function relation), Obstetrician (child birth), Ophthalmologist (eye), Orthopedic Surgeon (skeletal and joints), Otorhinolaryngologist (ear, nose, and throat), Oral Surgeon/Dentist (teeth and mouth), Pediatrician (infant and child), Pharmacologist (medications), Cosmetic Surgeon (appearance), Psychiatrist (mental and emotional disorders), Radiologist (medical radiation use), Sports Medicine (muscle and soft tissue), Thoracologist (torso, heart, and lungs), Trauma Surgeon (emergency damages), Urologist (urinary tract and urogenital system), Vascular Surgeon (artery and veins), Virologist (viruses and viral disease), Xeno / Exo (add to any of the above specialties) (man does my spell checker hate me right now)
Head Nurse
Nurse

Enlisted:
Medical Technician
Lab Technician
Corpsman/Paramedic
Orderly

Special Description:
Intern (Normally only at a Star Base) I also refer to this as a Medical Midshipman. The equivalent of the Cadet Cruise for medical personnel.
Resident Physician (First Year Position for a Graduated Medical Officer)

This is a very good list.

Below are all the MOS's (Military Occupational Specialty) within the current US Army Medical Corps:

Enlisted:

68A Medical Equipment Repairer
68D Operating Room Specialist
68E Dental Specialist
68G Patient Administration Specialist
68H Optical Laboratory Specialist
68J Medical Logistic Specialist
68K Medical Laboratory Specialist
68M Hospital Food Specialist
68P Radiology Specialist
68Q Pharmacy Specialist
68R Veterinary Food Inspection Specialist
68S Preventive Medicine Specialist
68T Animal Care Specialist
68V Respiratory Specialist
68W Health Care Specialist
68X Mental Health Specialist
68Z Chief Medical NCO

Officer:

60A OPERATIONAL MEDICINE
60B NUCLEAR MEDICINE OFFICER
60C PREVENTIVE MEDICINE OFFICER
60D OCCUPATIONAL MEDICINE OFFICER
60F PULMONARY DISEASE/CRITICAL CARE OFFICER
60G GASTROENTEROLOGIST
60H CARDIOLOGIST
60J OBSTETRICIAN AND GYNECOLOGIST
60K UROLOGIST
60L DERMATOLOGIST
60M ALLERGIST, CLINICAL IMMUNOLOGIST
60N ANESTHESIOLOGIST
60P PEDIATRICIAN
60Q PEDIATRIC SUB-SPECIALIST
60R CHILD NEUROLOGIST
60S OPHTHALMOLOGIST
60T OTOLARYNGOLOGIST
60U CHILD PSYCHIATRIST
60V NEUROLOGIST
60W PSYCHIATRIST
61A NEPHROLOGIST
61B MEDICAL ONCOLOGIST/HEMATOLOGIST
61C ENDOCRINOLOGIST
61D RHEUMATOLOGIST
61E CLINICAL PHARMACOLOGIST
61F INTERNIST
61G INFECTIOUS DISEASE OFFICER
61H FAMILY MEDICINE
61J GENERAL SURGEON
61K THORACIC SURGEON
61L PLASTIC SURGEON
61M ORTHOPEDIC SURGEON
61N FLIGHT SURGEON
61P PHYSIATRIST
61Q RADIATION ONCOLOGIST
61R DIAGNOSTIC RADIOLOGIST
61U PATHOLOGIST
61W PERIPHERAL VASCULAR SURGEON
61Z NEUROSURGEON
62 Medical Corps Officer
62A Emergency Physician
62B Field Surgeon
63 Dental Corps Officer
63A General Dentist
63B Comprehensive Dentist
63D Periodontist
63E Endodontist
63F Prosthodontist
63H Public Health Dentist
63K Pediatric Dentist
63M Orthodontist
63N Oral and Maxillofacial Surgeon
63P Oral Pathologist
63R Executive Dentist
64A Veterinary Corps Officer
640A Veterinary Services Food Safety Technician
65 Medical Specialist Corps Officer
65A Occupational Therapy
65B Physical Therapy
65C Dietitian
65D Physician Assistant
65X Specialist Allied Operations
66 Nurse Corps Officer
66B Community Health Nurse
66C Psychiatric/Mental Health Nurse
66E Perioperative Nurse
66F Nurse Anesthetist
66G Obstetrics and Gyneco
66H Medical-Surgical Nurse
66N Generalist Nurse
66P Family Nurse Practitioner
67 Medical Service Corps Officer
67A Health Services
67B Laboratory Sciences
67C Preventive Medicine Sciences
67D Behavioral Sciences
67E Pharmacy
67F Optometry
67G Podiatry
67J Aeromedical Evacuation
670A Health Services Maintenance Technician

Within your version of starfleet you can choose to omit any of these job classifications . . . for whatever given explination you have. Furthermore, just because these job skill classifications are present, does not mean that all are present at the same time. Some are far more common then others, and some, are very rare.

Even in Starfleet we see that certain medical skill sets still require that people travel light years to get that specific medical specialty. For instance CAPT Picard choose to take a very long and arguest shuttle trip to a starbase rather then recieve medical care aboard ship for his heart replacement procedure.

[Cpt. Lundgren]

Great list I know I will put that list of specialities to good use.
Ah, another great list while I was punching in this post

But Cpt. Lundgren, your forgetting several other types of medical personnel

No, just being guilty of being lazy English is after all only a second language to me, so I would have to look up to many medical words. As an example, both "vårdbiträde" and "Undersköterska" seems to be translated as nursery assistant. But I am not even sure it is right on the mark.

But I do have some insight in the medical world... a mother who is a lab technican, microbiology; an aunt who is a nurse; and my ex-girlfriend is currently studying to become a "Bachelor of Medical Science in Biomedical Laboratory Science- Physiology" (the swedish word is "Biomedicinsk analytiker med inriktning fysiologi." I think half of the degree is just to remember the name ). I have also been working at a hospital as a janitor. The only fixed department that I cleaned was the morgue every morning. After an episode there do I never again say "why does he go in there, is he stupid?" because I know that I would (anyone who care to know the full story has to ask me in another thread as I feel to much off-topic as it is ). And my current work assignmen is that I am involved in a computer related project at a hospital (application repackaging). Phew... that is a shortened list...

hrm... back on topic...

What would be the differens in education between a generalist and a specialist? Just a different track at Starfleet Medical, or is the specialisation an extra level of education? Currently, here in Sweden, a doctor has to be a general practitioner for 5 years before it is possible to apply for registration of a specialist competence. But after those 5 years they can try to register any amount of specialisations they want to.
The Starfleet track would already mean 10-11 year (depending if they have to do a cadet cruise right after the academy or not) before they normaly would have completed the Internship. Adding 5 years to that would make a newly baked specialist about 33-34 years old if they got into the academy at 18. Not to unreasonable, I guess.

I know several nurses if they read this . . . that would be insulted by that statement.

Yes, but that is because it is an entirely different education today. Ask them instead if they think a doctor should have a nurse education before they went to med school. I think the answer would be, that there wouldn't be as many doctors talking from their beloved backside if that was the case

[LUGTrekGM]

Typically, I would think that the nurse that was promoted equal to, of over a doctor CMO, would be transferred out (of a series) to a billet requiring that rank, (such as a huge starfleet hospital) and a new replacement sent.

Also, placing a junior line officer in charge is essentially a brevet promotion. If not, it is violating the chain of command, unless as narrator you ignore "Next Senior Line Officer with the completed professional requirements assumes command."

In a series, as Narrator, I would recommend against such things, as it is bad for morale. If a PC Captain did this, there'd be a significant morale problem upon his or her return.

Even if the next in line is not the best person available, it's his/her job to step up to the plate, and take charge, until relieved by higher authority.

[JALU3]

Great list I know I will put that list of specialities to good use.
Ah, another great list while I was punching in this post

Thank you, it is my pleasure. Although I am not a lifer, I am proud of my regiment, whether warrented or not . . . and anything I can do to help, it is my pleasure.

What would be the differens in education between a generalist and a specialist? Just a different track at Starfleet Medical, or is the specialisation an extra level of education? Currently, here in Sweden, a doctor has to be a general practitioner for 5 years before it is possible to apply for registration of a specialist competence. But after those 5 years they can try to register any amount of specialisations they want to.
The Starfleet track would already mean 10-11 year (depending if they have to do a cadet cruise right after the academy or not) before they normaly would have completed the Internship. Adding 5 years to that would make a newly baked specialist about 33-34 years old if they got into the academy at 18. Not to unreasonable, I guess.

That would explain why you have full Lieutenants coming out of certain programs out of Starfleet Medica (and verging on LtCmdr)l. But then again, as discussed before . . . those who come out of these programs tend to lack certain essential leadership skills.

Thus . . . why like all good officers, they should listen to and trust their NCOs. There is a reason why they are known as the backbone of any competant military organization.

Yes, but that is because it is an entirely different education today. Ask them instead if they think a doctor should have a nurse education before they went to med school. I think the answer would be, that there wouldn't be as many doctors talking from their beloved backside if that was the case

Oh so true. But one tends to loose skills if they don't use them . . . hopefully for doctors with a nursing and health care background, they odn't forget it . . . when they become all high and mighty

Typically, I would think that the nurse that was promoted equal to, of over a doctor CMO, would be transferred out (of a series) to a billet requiring that rank, (such as a huge starfleet hospital) and a new replacement sent.

Either that or they can forgo their promotion . . . or if they know the right PERSCOM personnel (always a good contact (you know what they say about knowing those four special people (admin, supply, medic, & cook)) . . . have a billet for a higher rank created for that ship/post.

Even if the next in line is not the best person available, it's his/her job to step up to the plate, and take charge, until relieved by higher authority.

This is why units experience peaks and lulls in officer ability. They are there to do their time . .. get the right marks on their record and move up. The enlisted ranks tend to do that to, but in older systems, most sailors rarely strayed away from a certain port or group of vessels. This creates a stable base which a good officer can rely on and learn from . . . furthermore it provides cohession within a unti, regardless of who the next "butter bar" is that steps through and thinks that hey are "high speed."

Reminds of a story once told to me by a CPL, who transfered to a medical MOS after being an artilleryman. One time he was out at NTC (Ft. Irwin) and he was out on the range with a "butter bar" and a SGM comes up and watches his battery do his thing. After a while he walked up to the Battery leader and provided a couple tips for the officer. Well being so "high speed", the officer would have none of it, and began to dress down the SGM. Well the SGM took it, and didn't say another word.

Well later on . . . the SGM came back . . . but this time, with his LTC.

Well suffice it to say, the 2LT was in the front leaning rest, to the quiet amusement of his soldiers, for a good long time as the LTC, started to give the young officer a dress down of his own.

Maybe this is something that should be done in game. I know I will do it to any upstart Ensign when I begin my campaign

[spyone]

What would be the differens in education between a generalist and a specialist? Just a different track at Starfleet Medical, or is the specialisation an extra level of education? Currently, here in Sweden, a doctor has to be a general practitioner for 5 years before it is possible to apply for registration of a specialist competence. But after those 5 years they can try to register any amount of specialisations they want to.

If you want to know in detail how one becomes a doctor in the US, I suggest an article at How Stuff Works ( http://people.howstuffworks.com/index.htm ) called How Becoming a Doctor Works, by Dr. Carl Bianco, MD.
I extract the most relevant bits here:
Generally, becoming a Doctor involves 4 years of college, 4 years of Medical School, and then a Residency of variable length. "Intern" is just a term for someone in their first year of residency.
During your fourth year in Medical School, you choose a specialty, and your residency will be based on what specialty you are pursuing. (Which contradicts a lot of what I've seen on TV. Go figure. )

Many specialties have sub-specialties that require additional training, which is called a Fellowship.
Thus, if you wanted to become a Cardiologist (which is a subset of Internal Medicine), you would do a 3 year Internal Medicine Residency, then a 3 year Cardiology Fellowship.

Here is a synopsis of different medical specialties and subspecialties and the length of their training programs (internship, residency, fellowship) after medical school:
· Anesthesiology - 4 years
· Dermatology - 4 years
· Emergency Medicine - 3-4 years
· General Surgery - 5 years; Subspecialties of Surgery require an additional 1 to 4 years after the 5 year residency, they include: Vascular Surgery, Cardio-Thoracic Surgery, Pediatric Surgery, Colon and Rectal Surgery. Some surgical specialties require 1-2 years of General Surgery, then an additional 3-5 years of specialty training, they include: Neurosugery, Orthopedic Surgery, Ophthalmology, Otolaryngology, Plastic Surgery, and Urology
· Internal Medicine - 3 years; subspecialties of Internal medicine require an additional 2-3 years after the 3 year residency, they include: Cardiology, Endocrinology, Gastroenterology, Geriatrics, Hematology, Oncology, Infectious Diseases, Nephrology, Pulmonary, Rheumatology
· Neurology - 4 years
· Obstetrics and Gynecology - 4 years
· Pathology - 4 years
· Pediatrics - 3 years; subspecialties of Pediatrics require and additional 2-3 years after the 3 year residency, they include: Pediatric Cardiology, Pediatric Endocrinology, Pediatric Gastroenterology, Pediatric Infectious Diseases, Pediatric Critical Care, Neonatology, Pediatric Nephrology, Pediatric Pulmonology, Pediatric Rheumatology
· Psychiatry - 4 years
· Radiology - 4-5 years; subspecialties of Radiology require and additional 1-2 years after residency, they include: Neuroradiology, Vascular and Interventional Radiology, Pediatric Radiology

So, a Cardio-thorasic Surgeon spent 4 years in college, 4 years in Medical School, 5 years as a Surgical Resident, then 1-4 years in a Cardio-thorasic Surgery Fellowship before taking the tests to get his license.

Starfleet seems to follow this model: 4 years of Academy pre-med, 4 years at Starfleet Medical, and then Residency. However, Dr Bashir, who probably specialized in Emergency Medicine, finished his Residency in just 2 years. This suggests that, perhaps, the Residency times across the board are shorter.

Also, remember to add a whole bunch of specialities that begin with "Xeno-".


As for what the education of a Science Branch officer is like, I think it is remarkably boring in comparison: I graduated Starfleet Academy having majored in Stellar Cartography, and now I am a Stellar Cartographer for Starfleet. Remember that Janeway was a Science officer under Captain Paris when he urged her to switch to command.
Remember also that Picard, who seemed to have been a Comand branch guy, was a Science Officer aboard USS Stargazer, so you don't have to be a blue-shirt to get that job. I kinda suspect that Picard majored in Archeology at the Academy, too.
Of course some people, like Riker for example, will choose to major in something like Modern Starship Command Theory, but I don't think your major is intimately tied to your branch assignment. Sure, the guy who wants to major in Warp Field Mechanics is more likely to want to pursue Engineering than Command, but ....
Remember that Sulu's first appearance was as the Ship's Geologist. So, he's a guy who got his degree in "interesting rocks", but he still wanted to command his own ship someday, so he went for Command instead of Science. Just like Picard.

As for why someone would choose Science branch when Command guys can do sciences too: Command guys keep getting moved. This year you are in Science, next year you're an engineer. They want you to get a little experience at a lot of jobs before you sit in the big chair. Meanwhile, a blue-shirt science guy can stay a geologist for the rest of his career. So the question is: do you just like rocks, or do you want to get married?

[Path Of Wrath]

Remember that Sulu's first appearance was as the Ship's Geologist.

Sulu's first appearance was actually as a Physicist. But your example still works.

[LUGTrekGM]

Jalu, all good info in that post. Yeah, the Chiefs on my ship were good guys, for the most part. I use enlisted people all the time in my games.

So, he's a guy who got his degree in "interesting rocks", but he still wanted to command his own ship someday, so he went for Command instead of Science.

I use this as an example of a Science guy getting Bridge Certified, and cross-decking, moving from Science branch to Command / Helm Branch (as it was in TOS, at least per FASA) [Which later becomes Ops, in TNG].

Funny though, that I have seen this in the real world Navy, and Trek, but hardly ever saw it in a PC, in any Trek game I ever ran, unless it was me as a player in someone else's game. I guess I have known more than my share of min-maxers. Seems like this is somewhat looser/ewasier to do in CODA, but I play LUG/ICON pretty much exclusively.

Also Kirk, as I recall, came up from Security Branch.

[spyone]

... moving from Science branch to Command / Helm Branch (as it was in TOS, at least per FASA) [Which later becomes Ops, in TNG].

Actually, Ops in TNG is not the same as Command/Helm. The guy who sat next to Data was the "Helm", which TNG called CONN. First Season it was Geordi, which is why he wore red. Worf, too, was a Conn Officer in the first season, which again is why he was in red (Despite being mainly Tasha Yar's flunkie). Wesley was Conn for a while, then Ro Laren, then they realized that they had enough characters and let an NPC take Conn.

Data's job at Ops is basicly a combination of what Checkov did ("Navigation"), and Scotty's job when he was at the Engineering console on the bridge. That and Spock's job got split between Tactical and Ops (both watch the sensors and launch probes).

Funny though, that I have seen this in the real world Navy, and Trek, but hardly ever saw it in a PC, in any Trek game I ever ran, unless it was me as a player in someone else's game.

Part of the problem here is that most game systems give you very little in a way to reflect where the character came from.
I mean, unless "Science Officer" is a character class, how do you reflect that your character used to be one? How is your "Conn Officer" with a bunch of science skills different from another with identical skills that the player sees as just "really interested in science"?

I have seen systems that tried to address exactly this problem, with varying degrees of success. The most common flaw in such systems is that they tend to allow old characters to become incredably powerful. As in, in order to make a 24-to-30 year old powerful enough to be interesting, they pack in so much power-per-year that anybody over 50 is ready to conquer the world. It certainly helps one understand Khan.

[spshu]

Actually, Ops in TNG is not the same as Command/Helm. The guy who sat next to Data was the "Helm", which TNG called CONN. First Season it was Geordi, which is why he wore red. Worf, too, was a Conn Officer in the first season, which again is why he was in red (Despite being mainly Tasha Yar's flunkie). Wesley was Conn for a while, then Ro Laren, then they realized that they had enough characters and let an NPC take Conn.

CONN is both Helm & Navigation from TOS. According the ST:TNG Companion, Worf's postion in season 1 was bridge officer, his station was on the bridge general manning a science station & filling in at Conn, Ops & tatical stations. I think he filled in more for Data & Tasha then for LeForge. It was indicated later that Worf got his lt.jg. rank by attending an Advance Security/Tatical School as did Ro Laren.

Data's job at Ops is basicly a combination of what Checkov did ("Navigation"), and Scotty's job when he was at the Engineering console on the bridge. That and Spock's job got split between Tactical and Ops (both watch the sensors and launch probes). <snip>

Ops does not regular do navigation. It had more to do with communication, allocating resources (who gets to use the sensors), etc.

[Tobian]

Operations is one of the most important yet probably borning (unless you like that kind of thing) jobs on the ship. As you say they allocate resources, redirect resources and coordinate all of the other departments to make sure the ship is effectivelly running. I believe, technically, Engineering is actually a department of Ops, hence they all wear gold, basically they are all concerned with the well-being and running of the ship. I'm never sure why CONN wears red in TNG, but they do, so I will have to get over it and move on to acceptance

[spyone]

Ops does not regular do navigation. It had more to do with communication, allocating resources (who gets to use the sensors), etc.

"Mr Data, lay in a course for ...."

I only go by what I see.

Of course, if you want the real reason for an "Ops" position in the TNG era, it's that someone in the Data makeup looked terrible dressed in blue, so they had to scrub the idea of him being the Science Officer.

I don't have any of the "Companion" books, but the Encyclopedia credits "Encounter at Farpoint" as establishing Worf's position on the Enterprise as "flight control officer (conn)". If that's wrong, that's where my mistake comes from.

(Ironicly, the term for that is "encyclopedic error": one source gets it wrong, then dozens reprint the wrong information relying on the accuracy of the original source.)

[spyone]

More much for the waters:

In 2368, Nova Squadron at the Academy made some reckless choices and then, under the orders of their lead Cadet, kept quiet about it. When the truth came out, the leader assumed full responsability and resigned, and the rest of them got sentanced to repeat their current year.

Wesley was a Sophomore at that point, so he spent 2369 as a sophomore as well, and was a Junior when he resigned in 2370. (If he hadn't repeated a year, he'd have been in Harry Kim's class).
Sito Jaxa was one of those Nova Squadron Cadets, so she spent 2369 repeating whatever year she'd been in in 2368.
By a date in 2370, Ensign Sito Jaxa had been serving aboard USS Enterprise for several months, and (if the Encyclopedia can be trusted on this) was up for promotion!
Pretty good for a Security Ensign with a black mark on her record who has never met the Captain. (even if he did specificly request her)

I think I put that down to the writers losing track of time.

[JALU3]

Hey, thought I would bring this thread up and back on track . . . sorry for being the one to derail it. But I have a question what unusual circumstances kept ENS H. Kim from being promoted past his entry level rank? If we assume Time in Service is one of the key factors, and that he did not have any administrative holds on his promotion progression, should he had been midway through his LT (j.g.) term by the time they got back to Earth?

I mean I understand that the Kim that got to Earth was an alternative reality version of the "Real" one . . . much like SCPO O'Brien is . . .
I understand that he found his way to the brig once or twice . . . but was that enough to keep his rank at ENS for 7 years?
Were his evaluation reports that bad by CMDR Chakotay that the only reason that he wasn't discharged was the fact that they were in the Delta Quadrant?

Given that there are enlisted servicemembers what is their "Usual" promotion track?
Do they have technical and command ranks? Are there enlisted command advisors? Do those have multiple ranks for the same position (such as the 3 different versions of first sergeant in the USAF)?

[The Tatterdemalion King]

*coughnecro*

To bad they never used any lowcost advisors . . . I can imagine alot of the more experienced prior service individuals here, of which I am not that experienced (IMHO), willing to do it for a couple walk on roles and basic cost of living.

RDM was in the navy for a bit, and he seemed to be the guy bringing in most of the military-isms. Roddenberry, by TNG's time, had gone a bit utopia-loony.

[The Tatterdemalion King]

I mean I understand that the Kim that got to Earth was an alternative reality version of the "Real" one . . . much like SCPO O'Brien is . . .
I understand that he found his way to the brig once or twice . . . but was that enough to keep his rank at ENS for 7 years?

Was the viewership actually strong enough to keep Voyager on TV for seven years?

These are the mysteries of the cosmos...