GenCon Decipher-Trek Review

[Lt. Dade]

Oh, and stop emailing Don about the article. He had nothing to do with it.



word,
will

[Captain Zymmer]

Hey Lt. Dade,

First off let me say I am glad you have come here to speak with us at Don's request. But then I notice you have 25 posts under your belt and you aa registered user from last year, so you must be a bit framilier with the place

Okay I guess what got the herd spooked was the word "levels" Now Don has tried his level-best (pun intended) to get everyone to understand that these are not D&D levels, but because of his NDA he cannot explain too much.

You use the word "advancements" as a suggestion.

Here's what I would like to ask you;

Can you explain, to the best of your knowledge from what you saw, how the "levels" or "advancements" work?

This might help people understand and get back online for what is promising to be a great game.

Thanks in advance

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Captain Zymmer
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Visit Star Trek:Lexington at;
http://www.usslexington.net
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[Don Mappin]

Thanks for jumping in, Will. I'm sure people will be interested to hear your impressions of the game and any details you can give.


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[Cochrane]

Will, please answer what you can of the following:

How many player species are there, and which ones are they?

How many of the professions are Starfleet, and how many are civilian?

Did you learn anything about the products to follow the core rules?

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Games... The... Final Product. These... are the books... of the Star... Trek RPG. Their five... year license. To explore... strange... new roles. To breathe... new... life into get... togethers. To bold... ly play what no... fan... has played... be... fore!

[Lt. Dade]

"Advancement" is the term used on the mock-up character sheets during the game. Basically, after a set number of experience points are earned, I think it's 1000, characters can raise their skill levels and other traits. So, rather than getting and potentially spending XP after every session, characters advance in stages. It's this format of stages that *I* relate to ICON's character creation process.

Let's say I, as Narrator, decide to start a Trek campaign for somewhat experienced characters. You might equate each advancement with a particular event or era in your character's life before he begins play, like his Cadet Cruise or the Cardassian Mission or whatever. As you play through the campaign, you could continue to use this viewpoint for your character. ("You know, Commander, I learned a thing or two about Romulan cloaking devices during my time on the USS Endeavour.") That's me talking, by the way. Not the game.

Even though it's risky, I'll use D&D as an example. A character level in D&D improves certain abilities (combat, saves, whatever) along a set course. Advancements in Star Trek indicate when and, presumably, by how much your character advances. Advancements do not say in what manner your character progresses. You could choose to focus on Engineering skills, or combat skills, or whatever you want. However, since we will have Advancements as a benchmark, it will be easier to determine what scenarios are right for what characters. After all, the stories that challenge Harry Kim are not the same ones that challenge Chief O'Brien or Data.

One Decipher-ite (I hesitate to drop names, here) explained it like this: if I tell you that I'm playing a 5th-level cleric, then you have a pretty good picture of my character already. If I tell you that I have a Starfleet officer with 5 Advancements, then you have a general idea of his experience, but you don't really know anything about my character. They grow more distinct, more individual, as they go on.

I feel like I'm being really redundant, but this seems like the most delicate issue. Advancements and levels are conceptually similar. In play, I expect they'll actually be pretty different.

word,
will

[calguard66]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Don:

Honestly, after reading through the article and all the tangets and D20 references, the offhand mentioning of levels, the lack of detail and the comparison of a phaser to a wand of sleep (!) I can't blame anyone who walks away with the wrong impression about the new RPG.
</font>

Actually the review made me more eager to see the game (well, except for the sleep-wand bit)... but that might be because I feel like I've gotten to know Don, Steve, et al a bit thanks to these boards, and I have the feeling that they wouldn't want to make a crappy game and then have to read complaints here for the next five years.

Which reminds me... any way to get ahold of "pre-market" copies? )

Of course not... but I had to ask.

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"I'd rather die standing than live on my knees..."
Shania Twain

[Lt. Dade]

Hi again,

Okay, on the topic of character races/species, I only know broad strokes. It is my understanding that there are many in the core book, when compared to the ICON core books. The best news I can give you is that these races are not show-specific. All of the names I heard dropped were species that have received a good deal of screen time. I can't be any more specific than that and still respect myself.

I'm not sure exactly how much the character professions really determine about the character. I mean, I could tell you that I played a Starfleet Engineer, but I don't know what exactly determines that. A character might be an Engineer just because that's the role he fulfills aboard the ship. I don't know if your profession determines which Professional abilities you get (like Command or Starship Crew) or vice versa.

What I can tell you, which I found very exciting, is that the core rules are so central and integral to the gameplay, that you do not need additional rulebooks to create a campaign set on a Cardassian ship or a Klingon ship or whatever. You could use the professions and species together to make a Cardassian Engineer or a Starfleet Engineer.

Regarding the next set of products: I recommend you see the Game Trade article. If the post elsewhere on this board is correct, it has far (far) more information than I do about a product schedule or catalog.

word,
will

[prophetsteve]

Funny, everything I have heard about DecTrek, even the quasi-d20 rumblings hasn't dampened my enthusiasm.

You find knee-jerk reactions everywhere when you make a new system.

There are some people who played ICON hate the idea that DecTrek may not even remotely look like LUGTrek. There are some that hate even the mention of d20 with Star Trek.

So what if there are elements that resemble d20 in DecTrek? It isn't Star Trek d20 here... even if it were - I wouldn't like it but I would try it. After all if I can be wrong about Star Wars d20 then I can be wrong about Star Trek d20...

BUT it isnt Star Trek d20. Its also not ICON anymore. Its seems that this new system will have some elements in common with d20 (the best elements IMHO) but still maintain the best aspects of LUGTrek.

I know next to nothing about the system but I am still pumped. It'll take more than someones opinion to make me buy a game or not. After all, if I had listened to the nay sayers, I wouldn't have bought Star Wars d20 and boy I am glad I did...

[This message has been edited by prophetsteve (edited 08-29-2001).]

[Steve Long]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">One Decipher-ite (I hesitate to drop names, here) explained it like this: if I tell you that I'm playing a 5th-level cleric, then you have a pretty good picture of my character already. If I tell you that I have a Starfleet officer with 5 Advancements, then you have a general idea of his experience, but you don't really know anything about my character. They grow more distinct, more individual, as they go on.</font>

Will may be referring to me. I know I certainly used this same explanation with a number of GenCon attendees.

I'm not doing to start answering rules or system questions, for a whole variety of reasons, but since Will raised this point I am going to offer a brief clarification. Then I will shut up and let the debatin' continue.

The difference between an "advancement" and a D20 "level" is this: a D20 level is more or less lockstep, whereas an advancement is flexible. When you gain a level in D20, you know pretty much exactly what you get. You know which saves improve, and by how much. You know exactly how much your ability to whack monsters improves. You know how many new spells you get (though of course, the choice of which spells you select is flexible).

An advancement, OTOH, allows you to decide how your character improves when he "levels up" (so to speak). If you choose to focus on skills, great, he becomes more skilled -- but now he may not be as good at, say, combat than another PC. Or you may want to beef up his Attributes, going for "raw talent" at the expense of "learning" (skills).

If the D20 rules said, "whenever you gain a level, you may increase any one save, any one attribute, or your BAB by +1," they would be more like advancements. That's not a precise correlation, but it's close enough for guv'mint work.

For an experienced gamer -- such as most people who post here -- advancements really aren't any different from spending Experience Points in Icon (or the HERO System, or a zillion other games). But for newcomers -- of whom we hope to attract many -- it's an easier concept to grasp. It guides and helps them, rather than tossing them into a pool of "Experience Points" and saying, "here, spend these on whatever you like."

Hopefully that clarifies the issue and allays a few fears. By and large, I think most of you, even rabid anti-D20-ites, will like the new system just fine.

Steve Long

[Lt. Dade]

What up,

Yeah, what Steve said.

Especially now that it seems I'm being read, I want to comment on the grammatical state of my article. Normally I'd be pretty put off by the sort of lazy writing I employed. I can only argue the hobbyist's defense: I didn't intend for it to be a formal article. Just a hiccup of fanboy enthusiasm.

"Essay," after all, means "to try."

word,
will

[This message has been edited by Lt. Dade (edited 08-29-2001).]

[Cochrane]

Thanks for the answers, Will.

Is the game trade article online? Can the magazine be found in many stores? Or is it only available to people in the industry?

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Games... The... Final Product. These... are the books... of the Star... Trek RPG. Their five... year license. To explore... strange... new roles. To breathe... new... life into get... togethers. To bold... ly play what no... fan... has played... be... fore!

[Lt. Dade]

Game Trade magazine isn't really a trade publication, per se. I didn't write the Game Trade post on this board, and I haven't yet seen the new issue.

I find it at my local comics/games retailer. Sometimes it's even free!

word,
will

[REG]

Why is it almost everybody assume that "level" is a bad thing? Because you get some automatic benefit upon reaching a new level the way D&D have been doing? (IMHO, that's not bad, it's a reward for achieving at this stage for your character.)

Nevertheless, it is simply a gauge of experience your character have attained. It also serve as a good guide for game masters in terms of what challenges should be provided for the next adventure, and I'm not just talking about putting up hostile creatures.

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Anyhoo, just some random thoughts...

[This message has been edited by REG (edited 08-29-2001).]

[Highway Hoss]

First of al Lt. Dade,thanks for taking the time to talk to us.
Did you see anything on the ship design section that's supposed to be in the core book? What's it like?

[Caretaker]

You guys have made me even more excited about the game. I did't think that was possible. I kind of wish we could preorder it now...