Klingons & Romulans

[mactavish]

Back to the Romulans.

The Romulan Star Empire of the mid-22nd century has roughly disc-shaped vessels with sweeping wing-like structures ending in war nacelles. They appear to utilize either a pulse disruptor or some kind of energy torpedo system (when they fired over the top of Enterprise in "Minefield"). They also appear to possess fairly substantial cloaking technology.

Though we don't truly know the Romulans until two centuries after the founding of the United Federation of Planets, we did see enough in the Enterprise episodes featuring them to see that they clearly had a centralized government (as evidenced by the appearance of a senator), they were militant, and they were technologically-advanced as a race.

I wrote in previous posts that Romulan scientfic advancement was slower than human development, so they are likely slightly more advanced than Starfleet, but less so than the Vulcans. Given their relatively slow scientific development, I am going to assume that they are equally sluggish in their social progress as well. Given that statement, it seems reasonable to assume that the Romulan Senate was likely establish centuries or even millennia earlier, and - since that system has worked so well for them - they have maintained it, making any necessary changes incrementally and over time.

I'm going to also assume that the Romulan Star Empire includes several other planetary systems by the mid-22nd century, given that they have been a spacefaring people for over a thousand years by that point. Since Romulus shares a star system with Remus, I'll also assume that the Remans have been subjugated for nearly the same length of time that the Romulans have been in the system.

Now I know that there are already plenty of features of the Romulan government already established in canon lore, so I'm not going to write anything additional in this thread.

During the Earth-Romulan War, the Romulans had a clear technological advantage, though not a huge one. In MY universe, Starfleet defeated them for three reasons:

1. The humans had support from the Andorians, Tellarites and Vulcans. This support may have been strategic, material, or even direct assistance in combat. I'm saying that Vulcan tacticians aided with planning, the Tellarites with engineering and technological assistance, and the Andorians with ships and personnel.

2. Humans produced ships and equipment faster than the Romulans. Despite their likely superior number of combat vessels and their potentially greater resource chain, the Romulans were used to slow and steady. Once humanity realized the level of the threat, they started cranking out new ships and equipment just like during World War II. In the four years the war lasted, human production hummed along, producing new ships constantly.

3. The Romulans were too arrogant to think that mankind - a relative newcomer in the scheme of things - could possibly best them. For this reason, they underestimated both Earth's capability to make war and its resolve to see it through to the final end.

The Romulans, too assured of their own superiority, failed to make use of their client races as soldiers or starship crewmembers. Consequently, while humanity had multiple allies, the Romulans had only themselves and perhaps some mercenaries to fight. Seeing how Romulans were pathologically secretive, I'm assuming that even those who they brought onboard to fight for them never knew much about them. Thus, the human war machine was likely far larger and far more diverse than the Romulan's military.

Why did the Romulans underestimate Earth? Well, I'm going to guess that the information they collected through their network of spies suggested as much. Reports of their technological capabilities from various sources would have indicated such things as a lack of deflector shields and tractor beams, limited weaponry, and a top speed of warp 5 (or so). While the Romulan ships were likely slower, they were more heavily armed and defended. Also, secrets gleaned from the Vulcans would have likely painted mankind as a race of inept barbarians, so this unintentional misinformation may have fed the Romulans' overconfidence, too.

More later.

mactavish out.

[Tobian]

My take on the Romulan war, given the events, especially as revealed in Season 4 of Enterprise is that the Romulans quite possibly had expansion plans, and were beginning to make the push to reconquer Vulcan, and quite possibly others in the would be early Federation. They manipulated Vulcan politics and use the Vulcan's own sense of superiority against them. What they didn't count on was the Humans, and how they (with Captain Archer at the helm) shattered this plan, and then began to form a co-defence treaty, which was exactly what they didn't want.

I think you're right, I think that the misinformation that the Vulcans had on the Humans would have led the Romulans to assume that the Humans were the weakest target of the group. However this I think was their undoing, because that very fact, and the growth of the foundings of the Federation, meant Earth had some very powerful friends to call on when the whole thing went badly, and the rest is of course history I think the Humans were, to the Romulans, more or less an irrelevancy, a puppet of the Vulcans, who were their real aim, and the tasty morsels of Andoria and Tellar would have fallen next, it's just the Humans both foiled their plans and proved instrumental in forming a bridge between the species, where only emnity had existed before!

[The Tatterdemalion King]

There's something weird about the Romulans. They seem expansionistic, arrogant and aggressive, but willing to hide behind their borders for century-long stretches at a time. Maybe the Doctrine of Unlimited Expansion isn't necessarily about glorious conquest; the Romulans in the Dominion War certainly seemed very cautious about what resources they used and where. It seems more like a slow-burn manifest destiny.

[Erik Filean]

There's something weird about the Romulans. They seem expansionistic, arrogant and aggressive, but willing to hide behind their borders for century-long stretches at a time. Maybe the Doctrine of Unlimited Expansion isn't necessarily about glorious conquest; the Romulans in the Dominion War certainly seemed very cautious about what resources they used and where. It seems more like a slow-burn manifest destiny.

What I liked about LUG's Taurhai was the way they contributed to explaining the last Romulan isolationist spell--the Romulans weren't really hiding behind their borders, they just chose to be inactive along one while they expanded or dealt with business on another side of their territory. It's not impossible that they were expanding and consolidating elsewhere during the hundred years after the Earth-Romulan war brought them to an impasse in that direction.

[Tobian]

Yeah the Taurhai Unity were a pretty good explanation, but beyond that, yes, Space is 3D, and given they had had a withering defeat against the Federation, and moreover, with warp speeds increasing exponentially, and Romulus being So close to the nascent Federation, it was probably a much wiser move to build a wall, and consolidate. The Romulans also have the Klingons to contend with too, as well as probably a few other alien races who may be more or less powerful than them (Such as the Breen?) so it's not hard to imagine that they decided to keep away from the Federation, and concentrate on softer and easier targets, as while they are expansionistic, expanding into the Federation must have just been too hard for them!

[mactavish]

Besides humans and Klingons, who do you suppose the 22nd-century Romulans had to regularly deal with? The Breen were mentioned, as were the Taurhai, but who else?

What relationship do the Romulans of this era have with, say, the Nausicaans? The Orions? The Suliban (Cabal or otherwis)? What about the Andorians, Tellarites, and Vulcans?

Well, clearly they had contact with Vulcan. Indeed, it seems that they were - as Tobian has written - attempting to directly (though covertly) influence Vulcan politics in an effort to take control of their people's homeworld. It seems also that they had operatives on Andoria, as they were able to kidnap an Aenar [Andorian subspecies] for use as a pilot of one of their chameleon attack drones. Given the interactions between the Vulcans, Andorians and Tellarites, it seems likely that the Romulans dealt with the natives of Tellar as well.

Now how about the Klingons? We know that they eventually made contact, even forming a troubled alliance for a time, but I am a bit confused by that fact. If the Klingons have contact with Vulcan (as we know they did) and they also have contact with Romulus (as they eventually did), why didn't they ever say to the Vulcans, "Hey, we met a race that is nearly identical to you genetically. They call themselves Romulans, and they sure do look like you guys"? It seems to me that neither humans nor Vulcans actually know about the Romulan-Vulcan connection until the 23rd century.

Oh, as an aside - not being a TOS fan, I wasn't aware of the connection - I learned that the Malurians from the Enterprise episode "Civilization" were eventually wiped out by the Nomad probe in Star Trek. The probe apparently was launched from Earth, met up with an alien machine, the two merged, and the resultant machine tried to destroy all organic life. They wiped out 4 billions Malurians before eventually being stopped by Kirk and the NCC-1701 Enterprise. I like the Malurians as an enemy race, and now I feel free to use them however I want, knowing that their civilization will eventually be destroyed.

So anyway, the Malurians do work well as an enemy, particularly since Archer screwed them out of a lucrative business on a pre-warp planet. Did they speak for their government? Probably not, but surely they would have spread the word that humans were bad and not to be trusted. Given that a human machine eventually causes the race's extinction, it seems that they were right.

Okay, Romulans... who else did they have contact with? Were there Romulan agents on Risa? How about Earth or other human-occupied worlds? They could certainly pass as Vulcans, and their undercover agents would certainly have the training to pull it off. Since humans didn't care for Vulcans, and since they were fairly deferential towards them, they would probably leave any Romulans posing as Vulcans alone.

So anyway, I think I've written enough about these two races for the time being. I think I'll start a new thread to talk about some of the races introduced in Enterprise: the Xindi, the Suliban, the Denobulans, and some of the other, minor species we were shown.

mactavish out.

[The Tatterdemalion King]

Now how about the Klingons? We know that they eventually made contact, even forming a troubled alliance for a time, but I am a bit confused by that fact. If the Klingons have contact with Vulcan (as we know they did) and they also have contact with Romulus (as they eventually did), why didn't they ever say to the Vulcans, "Hey, we met a race that is nearly identical to you genetically. They call themselves Romulans, and they sure do look like you guys"? It seems to me that neither humans nor Vulcans actually know about the Romulan-Vulcan connection until the 23rd century.

What about the Rigelians? They're close enough genetically to share diseases and attendant medical information–even if they have four or five genders. Given the complicated histories of some spacefaring cultures, something like that might not be notable.

Besides, I don't see a Klingon sitting around chatting with a Vulcan about genetic data they've collected from a secretive, xenophobic alien culture. It's entirely possible that rogue Klingon scientists or uncharacteristically cooperative Vulcans would have noticed it–But what're the chances the Vulcans didn't know the Romulans were, well, Romulans? T'pol's expression in "Minefield" was certainly suggestive. Some Vulcans knew about the Romulans. How extensive was the Romulan infiltration of their society? Given that basic anthropological details like how they reproduced were unknown by educated, well-traveled humans in the 23rd century, how many more human questions would have been answered by a stony Vulcan silence?

Okay, Romulans... who else did they have contact with? Were there Romulan agents on Risa?

Pfft. Of course. Everyone has agents on Risa. Pre-Federation, the Risan government is probably totally corrupt.

How about Earth or other human-occupied worlds?

Given that the Klingons were able to capture someone off of Earth, this also seems likely.

[Phoenix]

I just had a thought about the H'urk - What if they weren't conquers, say a species that only wanted to bring the Klingons out of some type of disaster or to introduce them to the greater interstellar culture. Only to have been attacked (possible destroyed) by the Klingons (the reason we don't know who they are)?

Just a thought, as history is written by the victors and all that.