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Thread: More Trek Movie News (From Scifi.com)

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan van Eyk
    There is just one problem. The story of Kirks first mission on Enterprise is already told ( in a book ) and I doubt they are just filming that said book...
    Christ, I hope not...that book was dreadful. I can only hope that this is the story of Kirk's first mission as CO of the Enterprise, so that it can trump that book.
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  2. #17
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    It seems to me Trek movies and series never bothered much about the books so far, so I don't think anyone at Paramount or elsewhere will be too concerned if a book happen to relate what the movie was supposed to be about.

    I'm not quite sure I agree with some of the characters descriptions either. Bones danger-loving ? Uhura tom-boyish (granted, it's hard to judge since she spent most of TOS talking about hailing frequencies being opened) ?

    I'm not dead set against recasting characters, and not against setting the series in the past either (though I prefer going forward than backward, but I liked Enterprise, for instance), and if we can escape a Starfleet Academy episode, the better.
    But I'm somehow getting tired of movies based on an old book, comic, series, or older movie. Is there so hard to imagine something new ? Granted, for Star Trek I expect the best way to rejuvenate the franchise is to have the old crew back, as they're the most emblematic of the series but sometimes I really feel we keep getting old stories in a new package, and that's so sad (especially with an universe as rich and full of potential as Star Trek's). And this has nothing to do with how I would like Star Trek to be.
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  3. #18
    It's emblematic of the paucity of good ideas in televised space-opera-y SF. How many shows about a diverse crew of dudes with a travelling device are there? And of those, how many of them just end up doing something about some galactic war or whatever? The conservatism within the TV industry is reflected in the retreading of ground that was, at one time, the frontier. Retreading it over and over until it's worn down, a bare patch of dirt covered in indistinguishable footprints.
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
    It's emblematic of the paucity of good ideas in televised space-opera-y SF. How many shows about a diverse crew of dudes with a travelling device are there? And of those, how many of them just end up doing something about some galactic war or whatever? The conservatism within the TV industry is reflected in the retreading of ground that was, at one time, the frontier. Retreading it over and over until it's worn down, a bare patch of dirt covered in indistinguishable footprints.
    Not so much as the politcal leaning, as it is the fear by the large studios to take risks on new ideas . . . If the idea hasn't atleast made a significant amount of money int he past . . . the idea wont carry. Furthermore, new movies are made by committee to get max profit . . . and if anything is new, it has to be young, edgy, "XTREME!"

    So chances are . . . we'll see the same rehashed themes . . . with the same rehashed character sterotypes . . . in a different package.

    However, I am open for anything trek, at least at first. I watched the beginnings of Enterprise . . . before they tacked on the Star Trek in the title, because the were loosing the genras base. And as said by others I will give it ashot and give them my $10 bucks at the box office . . . only problem is that our genra does have the mass public appeal that other genras have that allow "regular people" to transend the "geek/nerd barrier" to watch our shows.

    What we they need to see is a story founded in classic themes of good verse evil, the sacrafice of the few for the greater good of the many, and all the other themes that touch the core of what decent people see as their own beliefs.
    But chances are we'll get some preachy undertone by one group or the other
     
    (and given the lean towards the left in hollywood)
    . . .

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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Tyger
    Well, I think that the vehement reaction to this news is just further proof that the Trek community is as fractured as the American voting public is over politics. Everyone seems to want their little niche covered, and they spit fire upon any concept that isn't precisely what they want.

    But, there are a few of us who want every Trek venture to succeed. We may not like everything that the franchise puts out (I couldn't watch Voyager, for example, and have been disappointed by three movies), but we remain hopeful the next one will work, regardless of what era it's in.
    Sea Tyger,

    Do you really want EVERY Trek venture to succeed without knowing anything about it? Why?

    Aren't there some things that you consider make a program Star Trek other than the titles? If those things, whatever you consider them to be, were absent from a series, would you consider it to be Star Trek?

    I understand your frustration about the fragmenting of the fanbase (sort of an enevtual byproduct of having serval series with different casts, and using differenrt casts to represnet the same characters is sort of asking for more fragmentation), but I am concerned about automatically rooting for something just out of support for a brand name.


    I plan to judge the new Trek film (and hopefully anything else) based on it's own merits. It if is a great film, wonderful, but I won't go dragging my friends of to the cinema to see it if I think it stinks, just because it has Star Trek in the title. Doing that just eliminates any reason for making good sequels.

  6. #21
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    Don't get me wrong, even if I would have preferred a future Trek, I like this movie idea. I am very curious to see a new cast and new approaches to the roles, fit to the 21st century SFX and storytelling.

    I am always a fan of good Trek, whatever the time.

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  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by JALU3
    Not so much as the politcal leaning, as it is the fear by the large studios to take risks on new ideas . . .
    ...that's what I said.

    (and given the lean towards the left in hollywood). . .
    With films like Die Hard getting produced, it's hard to imagine that an actual leftist bias exists in Hollywood. If there is, it's probably some weird American left that would be seen as just right of centre anywhere else in the developed world.

    ––––

    The fetishization of the brand name is what they want from you, of course. Hoping that you're going to go into that theatre and get more Star Trek is probably a bad idea. At best you'll get some rehashed Trek-esque plot, and maybe a 'Kirk learns a lesson about being human' thing at the end. I don't know. No real high hopes for this.

    But since the TOS remastered DVDs are coming out, it'll probably make the original dvds cheaper. So I'm still kinda happy.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
    ...that's what I said.



    With films like Die Hard getting produced, it's hard to imagine that an actual leftist bias exists in Hollywood. If there is, it's probably some weird American left that would be seen as just right of centre anywhere else in the developed world.
    As not to let this devolve into a political discussion . . .
     
    You are right, that what the US sees as left would be seen as just right or just left of center in other nations. But we're Askewed like that. It's a matter of perseption of the viewer. However, from my point of view . . . there have been far more movies produced with far greater fan fair that have US left views being advanced then movies where US right views are being advanced. But the reason why the spoiler tag is here, is and so no one who wishes to listen to my political discussion does not have to read. For anyone who has been on these boards long enough know that I tend to discuss politics.

    But I get what you are saying about Hollywood being conservative, as they are riskadverse, another term for use of the word conservative, rather then the political meaning of the word. Sorry about the misunderstanding.


    ––––

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
    The fetishization of the brand name is what they want from you, of course. Hoping that you're going to go into that theatre and get more Star Trek is probably a bad idea. At best you'll get some rehashed Trek-esque plot, and maybe a 'Kirk learns a lesson about being human' thing at the end. I don't know. No real high hopes for this.

    But since the TOS remastered DVDs are coming out, it'll probably make the original dvds cheaper. So I'm still kinda happy.
    I hope it's more then Trek-esque . . . but more like returning to the heart of trek . . . mankind getting past their differences and venturing into the stars peacefully together, and kicking but taking names (and when the need a rises, a couple sexy thongs on the way ) when the need a rises. Where, throught the advancement of technology, we're able to solve the worlds problems and help other sentient species solve theirs, while enduring our young sentient species, to the older sentient species of our corner of the galactic neighberhood.

    I wonder if they'll throw in an even wider diverse crew in this time, to make it more PC. Say a Actively practicing Muslim Captain as a stand in for Kirk, a Christian Sub-Continent Indian as a stand in for Scotty . . . and the list goes on. If so, I wont see it . . . reimagining is one thing . . . but canon only stretches so far in my book.

    I mean I like the current Starbuck, but I wont lie, and say it didn't irk me a little when I first found out that they are creating another strong yet vunerable stereotypical female lead role type out of it.

    Wouldn't it be interesting if they create a crew, that weren't the best, but some of the one off the brighter crew, that parallels the original . . . kind of always trying to strive for the linelight . . . but is always out done by the Crew of the Enterprise? Kind of like slightly better then average Joes and Janes . . . in space . . . in Star Trek.
    It would be slightly comical, but can be just as serious.
    Damn it . . . Kirk's crew has out did us again! Damn it!
    Oh no, did someone paint a red stripe on our shuttle again? . . . beam us up! . . . Beam us up! . . . *Boom* . . . that was a close one
    Last edited by JALU3; 08-11-2007 at 09:45 AM.

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  9. #24
    What's with the spoiler tags?

    Quote Originally Posted by JALU3
    I wonder if they'll throw in an even wider diverse crew in this time, to make it more PC. Say a Actively practicing Muslim Captain as a stand in for Kirk, a Christian Sub-Continent Indian as a stand in for Scotty . . .
    Were a new series in the works, that would certainly be more apropos than a bunch of quasiagnostic white guys as usual.

    I mean I like the current Starbuck, but I wont lie, and say it didn't irk me a little when I first found out that they are creating another strong yet vunerable stereotypical female lead role type out of it.
    As opposed to what? Some simpering pussy? They just changed her sex–the starting point was already there in the original.

    Oh no, did someone paint a red stripe on our shuttle again? . . . beam us up! . . . Beam us up! . . . *Boom* . . . that was a close one
    Red Dwarf?
    Last edited by The Tatterdemalion King; 08-11-2007 at 04:23 PM.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King
    What's with the spoiler tags?
    Do to the political discussion rules on the main forum . . . those who wish not to read it, need not if they so choose to. That also bring me up to the point of the Spoiler warning and tags . . . we all need to use them more often.




    Quote Originally Posted by TTK
    Were a new series in the works, that would certainly be more apropos than a bunch of quasiagnostic white guys as usual.
    I am not saying that a new series should be "white washed", which some would argue has happened to mainstream television (over 95% of all new characters are caucasian or of european ethnic origin) . . . however, what I am saying is to change a prestated character to make them more PC is something that I don't believe is necessay, and if anything takes away from the character that is portrayed.



    Quote Originally Posted by TTK
    As opposed to what? Some simpering pussy? They just changed her sex–the starting point was already there in the original.
    How was the same point made? Was the character a female imprint of the original? I highly doubt that.
    However, that type of character stereotype, the Strong yet vunerable female lead, has been over done and isn't realistic of the wide varity of female personality types that exist in real life. For instance, how about a masculain lesbian, or how about the post-feminist independent supporting woman, or the striving for independence post-teenage girl discovering what it means to be a woman.



    Quote Originally Posted by TTK
    Red Dwarf?
    Yes and no . . . comedy is good . . . but I never thought of it as a central point of Star Trek. But what alot of newer series have in them are characters that are easy to relate to, and who are if anything under achievers, and/or the common type of characters that were once only background, but have moved to the foreground and who make up the mass majority of the population. Star Trek, IMHO, hasn't had anything like that. The closest that we've had is a SCO O'Brien or a LT Barclay, or maybe even a Rom.

    ----

    But back at the topic at hand. I hope, whatever is created, is done well. And they will at least get $10 bucks from me, and more, cause I am dragging my wife with me.
    The biggest thing though, is moving outside of the super-nerd stigma that has surrounded our genra . . . and make it appealing to the rest of society . . . just as Star Wars had done . . . so although nerdy, it isn't something that has to be hidden.

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  11. #26
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    I am really doubtful of this whole "reinventing" of the franchise, which is funny, because here I am on the opposite side compared to Battlestar Galactica, where I am a fan of the new show but not the old one.
    I think the reason for this is that I really grew up with Star Trek as it is, mainly TNG, and really like it just so.
    The difference between these two franchises however is that the original series was very short lived and the reimagined is not. In Star Trek we already have a rich universe, full of stories, background and "facts". I fear that it won't be possible to reinvent the franchise without neglecting the previous stories and contradict them in a profound way. And I would hate it if Star Trek would just become another sci-fi show, because it is so much more. While not all episodes had a message, many had and Trek used to be intelligent sci-fi.
    If however this essence of Star Trek is caught in this reinvention as well, I think I could live with it - although I am not sure if it would still be Star Trek for me.
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan van Eyk
    I am really doubtful of this whole "reinventing" of the franchise, which is funny, because here I am on the opposite side compared to Battlestar Galactica, where I am a fan of the new show but not the old one.
    I think the reason for this is that I really grew up with Star Trek as it is, mainly TNG, and really like it just so.
    The difference between these two franchises however is that the original series was very short lived and the reimagined is not. In Star Trek we already have a rich universe, full of stories, background and "facts". I fear that it won't be possible to reinvent the franchise without neglecting the previous stories and contradict them in a profound way. And I would hate it if Star Trek would just become another sci-fi show, because it is so much more. While not all episodes had a message, many had and Trek used to be intelligent sci-fi.
    If however this essence of Star Trek is caught in this reinvention as well, I think I could live with it - although I am not sure if it would still be Star Trek for me.
    I agree with what you say and I am just the same in my opinion of the new Battlestar Galactica. However, I don't feel that the reimagined Battlestar Galactica is the same show as the old one, it just uses some of the same concepts and goes about telling a radically different story with different messages to be taken away. If the same thing had been done with Star Trek, I wouldn't feel like it was Star Trek.

  13. #28
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    I think the main reason most of the movies were successful in the past is because the audience gave a crap about the characters from TOS and TNG. Plus, the film makers gave the movies just enough pizzaz to draw in non-series fans as well.

    Will re-casting iconic characters draw success at the box office? Will we care enough about these new faces on old, well-loved characters? I have no idea yet obviously, but I'm skeptical. Name a film franchise that has re-cast its iconic characters and succeeded? The Bond series is about the only example I can think of, and Bond certainly wasn't a "cast of seven" or even a "cast of three" to replace.

    I just hope it's a good film. I'll give it a chance, though.

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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liquidator Queeg
    I think the main reason most of the movies were successful in the past is because the audience gave a crap about the characters from TOS and TNG. Plus, the film makers gave the movies just enough pizzaz to draw in non-series fans as well.

    Will re-casting iconic characters draw success at the box office? Will we care enough about these new faces on old, well-loved characters? I have no idea yet obviously, but I'm skeptical. Name a film franchise that has re-cast its iconic characters and succeeded? The Bond series is about the only example I can think of, and Bond certainly wasn't a "cast of seven" or even a "cast of three" to replace.

    I just hope it's a good film. I'll give it a chance, though.

    LQ

    While I agree with you for the most part, film series have had characvrers recast and continued on. It is just that the practice has been dropped in recent years. Doctor Who gets away with it, but that aeries used a novel approach.

    Go back to the 40s and 50s and it was much more common. FOr example, the Charlie Chan series managed to contiune on successfully despire three changes in the lead character, as well as changing studios. But, the films did start to drop in quality.

    THe hard part about recasting is that the replacement not only has to be able to play the part, but needs to act like the orginal actor playing the part, as comparisons are inevitable. It'S a bit easier with a literary character, as the new actor can try to go back to the source and capture what was written. The other option is to get a VERY charismatic actor who can reinevert the role.

  15. #30
    Recasting's easier with movies–you have enough time to re-establish who everybody is, and enough distance from the last installment that the differences aren't totally jarring. With a series you need to be able to immediately *ping* to everybody–the characters are the linchpin for the viewer's sympathies and interest in the show (unless it's an anthology series, which is more like a series of short movies anyway).

    So they might get away with it for a new series of movies. It worked with Saavik.
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