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Thread: [CODA] Star Trek RPG 2nd Edition (done by us :))

  1. #1
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    [CODA] Star Trek RPG 2nd Edition (done by us :))

    Quote Originally Posted by Mac417 View Post

    As C5 said in the 'The End Is Here' Thread let's go for it
    Last edited by Cut; 01-12-2008 at 01:28 PM.

  2. #2
    I nominate myself developer and editor. We should figure out in what venue the secondary discussions will take place–this board is too slow and too permanent. I'm a student and freelancer, so I have free time in moderate chunks and then hard blocks of no-time, but I'm capable of investing a significant amount of effort into this to get it right. I assume most other members of this board have jobs and lives and things, too, and that scheduling this like a paying job would be impossible.

    Before we discuss the outline, let's get a roll-call and any RPG writing experience...
    Last edited by The Tatterdemalion King; 01-12-2008 at 12:38 PM.
    Portfolio | Blog Currently Running: Call of Cthulhu, Star Trek GUMSHOE Currently Playing: DramaSystem, Swords & Wizardry

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King View Post
    I nominate myself developer and editor. We should figure out in what venue the secondary discussions will take place–this board is too slow and too permanent. I'm a student and freelancer, so I have free time in moderate chunks and then hard blocks of no-time, but I'm capable of investing a significant amount of effort into this to get it right. I assume most other members of this board have jobs and lives and things, too, and that scheduling this like a paying job would be impossible.

    Before we discuss the outline, let's get a roll-call and any RPG writing experience...
    Playtested on Spacedock, wrote various bits of a TNG netbook for CODATrek (mostly character, tech, and starship writeups.
    chris "mac" mccarver
    world's angriest creative mind

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    I did up a bunch of the movie aliens and a CODA sourcebook on artificial lifeforms that was online here for a while; feel free to use the material, but give me credit in the new work if you do. My RPG experience includes writing on all of the books for Cubicle 7's Victoriana line, writing the London sourcebook for Adamant's Imperial Age line.

    I'm not available to work on anything fulltime. I've got my comps coming up and don't know that I really want to slice off time from paying writing for a fan book.

    Good luck.

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    Maybe we should ask Magnus to make this into a secluded subforum, just to discuss things, and to be safe from copyright issues.

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    I would like to help too

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cut View Post
    ...and to be safe from copyright issues.
    Copyright law doesn't protect the system itself, but the prose, visuals, and layouts. I'll dig up the law itself when I have time, but I researched it when I considred bringing the old Victory Games' James Bond system back. The mechanics aren't subject to protection, as the text is.

    So if you do a complete rewrite of the system itself, you're safe; the use of the Paramount property is where you're likely to run into trouble. Make sure you highlight this is a fan-effort and not for sale and you should be okay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King View Post
    this board is too slow and too permanent.
    Slow? I might have agreed with that a week ago, when it still was on its temporary home. But it has responded quite crisp since the move. If it still appears slow to you, drop me a pm, and we can look into if it is anything server side or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cut View Post
    Maybe we should ask Magnus to make this into a secluded subforum, just to discuss things, and to be safe from copyright issues.
    It is not that much problem to set up a hidden subforum. There are already a few. The political forum for example.

    The two main headaches are copyrights and trademarks. All fan made material are in a legally gray area. So I would recommend keeping a healthy distance. This would be my main considerations when deciding if i would offer space and bandwidth for the final product.

    Breaking things down into several modules can keep the core rules safe in case there is a policy change at the legal department. Besides, keeping Trek specific information in one book, and the specific rules in another, would make it more simple to use the system for more settings as well.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Lundgren View Post
    Slow? I might have agreed with that a week ago, when it still was on its temporary home. But it has responded quite crisp since the move. If it still appears slow to you, drop me a pm, and we can look into if it is anything server side or not.
    It is not that much problem to set up a hidden subforum. There are already a few. The political forum for example.
    More the medium, not the specific site. The non-immediate nature and the permanency (heh) of the forums makes discussions on them more like statements rather than just chatting.

    The two main headaches are copyrights and trademarks. All fan made material are in a legally gray area. So I would recommend keeping a healthy distance. This would be my main considerations when deciding if i would offer space and bandwidth for the final product.

    Breaking things down into several modules can keep the core rules safe in case there is a policy change at the legal department. Besides, keeping Trek specific information in one book, and the specific rules in another, would make it more simple to use the system for more settings as well.
    Historically, what has been Paramount's attitude toward things like this? What actions have they taken?
    Portfolio | Blog Currently Running: Call of Cthulhu, Star Trek GUMSHOE Currently Playing: DramaSystem, Swords & Wizardry

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    AFAIK, I think CBS/Paramount has relaxed their stance on fan-based material a great deal from the days when they would shut down fansites and such left and right. The fact that we have sites like Memory Alpha, DITL, and TrekCore.com, as well as fan-produced films like New Voyages and Of Gods and Men, seems testament.

    The way it looks these days, as long as we aren't making money off this venture we should be okay. If doing a fan-made tabletop RPG would get us strung up the flagpole, I doubt any of the aforementioned would even exist.

    I totally understand where Magnus is coming from if he's trepidatious, though.

    Personally, I'm more concerned about the legalities of using the Coda System than those regarding Trek.
    chris "mac" mccarver
    world's angriest creative mind

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Mac417 View Post
    Personally, I'm more concerned about the legalities of using the Coda System than those regarding Trek.
    First question: after re-writing, re-naming, and probably changing some parts, what more needs to be done?

    Second: Is Decipher even in the RPG business any more? Do they care what happens to CODA?
    Portfolio | Blog Currently Running: Call of Cthulhu, Star Trek GUMSHOE Currently Playing: DramaSystem, Swords & Wizardry

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by black campbellq View Post
    Copyright law doesn't protect the system itself, but the prose, visuals, and layouts. The mechanics aren't subject to protection, as the text is.
    While the mechanics do not fall under copyright, they can be considered trademarked... and trademark law is much clearer. It also favors the trademark holder, although they must defend the trademark to prevent it from lapsing. In other words, if they send an order to cease and desist which is subsequently ignored, the law backs them 100% should they file suit in response.

    I would take any such development project to its own site, lest they attempt to shut this one down in response. I'm not just talking about Paramount, Decipher could very well do the same. The CODA rules remain theirs, unless that ownership reverts to its authors at some point in the future. This is rarely the case for entire rules systems, however. Better safe than sorry, regardless.
    “In our every deliberation, we must consider the impact of our decisions on the next seven generations.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by RaconteurX View Post
    While the mechanics do not fall under copyright, they can be considered trademarked... and trademark law is much clearer. It also favors the trademark holder, although they must defend the trademark to prevent it from lapsing. In other words, if they send an order to cease and desist which is subsequently ignored, the law backs them 100% should they file suit in response.

    I would take any such development project to its own site, lest they attempt to shut this one down in response. I'm not just talking about Paramount, Decipher could very well do the same. The CODA rules remain theirs, unless that ownership reverts to its authors at some point in the future. This is rarely the case for entire rules systems, however. Better safe than sorry, regardless.
    Well, I just checked the indicia in the books themselves and there's no language laying claim to the Coda System trademark.

    Still, it's something to think about...
    chris "mac" mccarver
    world's angriest creative mind

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Mac417
    I just checked the indicia in the books themselves and there's no language laying claim to the Coda System trademark.
    Such language is not required, and trademarks don't necessarily have to be registered for a company to litigate. I suggest everyone read up on intellectual property, trademark and brand identity before making any grandiose plans that will get someone sued.
    “In our every deliberation, we must consider the impact of our decisions on the next seven generations.”

    -- Great Law of the Iroquois Confederacy

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    Quote Originally Posted by RaconteurX View Post
    Such language is not required, and trademarks don't necessarily have to be registered for a company to litigate. I suggest everyone read up on intellectual property, trademark and brand identity before making any grandiose plans that will get someone sued.
    Hence that part of my previous post about us thinking more about this.

    I know if we're wanting to undertake this, we're more keen on just using Coda than developing a new game system out of whole cloth, but in order for this to get done without opening us and TrekRPG.net to reprisals, it's probably something worth considering.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tatterdemalion King View Post
    First question: after re-writing, re-naming, and probably changing some parts, what more needs to be done?

    Second: Is Decipher even in the RPG business any more? Do they care what happens to CODA?
    I'm thinking if Warren Holland wants to claim that the Coda System's in its entirety owned by Decipher even if no further publications of the rules are produced and all he ever wants to do with the system is keep it in a jar on his desk till warp drive gets invented, he can do that and can sic the lawyers upon the dissenters with extreme prejudice.

    Not trying to urinate on everyone's Frosted Flakes and saying we *shouldn't* do a new edition of the game, I'm just thinking using a proprietary system without the publisher's permission may be an idea worth some thought. There's other open-source RPG systems (Tri-Stat, FUDGE, Fuzion) if we don't want to create a new system from scratch.
    Last edited by Mac417; 01-13-2008 at 01:34 AM.
    chris "mac" mccarver
    world's angriest creative mind

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