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Thread: New Ships vs Canon Ships

  1. #1
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    I did notice that there was a lot of material as well. I was also thinking that if I had time over Christmas break that I might try to through together a quick VB program with all of the options.... and I may or may not have time with my other projects.

    However if anyone is interested in working together on this It might get bumped up a little higher on the things to do list.

    Castle

    PS. That is assuming that nobody has any problem with the idea


    [This message has been edited by Castle (edited 12-02-2000).]

  2. #2
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    Originally posted by Cmdr Powers:
    I started to scribble some notes about the Akira class and realized that Spacedock has one problem- its too much. You have so many choices for each section that you MUST carefully plan your ship in advance. If you're doing a new ship the number of choices are fine- just get to work and fill in that hull. If you're doing a canon ship, you had better carefully research her before cracking open SD. I can see where a spreadsheet will come in mighty handy. I can also see where several hours will go by while you put together your dreamship.
    Kinda makes you feel like a Real Live Engineer, doesn't it? Just remember to have your papers spread all over the place and stained...oh yeah, a half empty mug of cold coffee would be a good touch to really assist with ambiance


  3. #3
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    Guys, before you start making pages o' notes to do your very own Akira (or whatever), don't forget: the SHIP RECOGNITION MANUAL will be available soon. It already has all the canon 24th century Starfleet ships (with one exception). I've done all the paper-scribbling for you.

    But of course, that's not to say you can't come up with your own versions if you wanna. However, no sense wasting time re-inventing the wheel. At least wait a few days for my version, than fiddle with that.

    Steve Long

  4. #4
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    Hey Steve, just out of curiosity, what's the one exception?


    Greg, who tried to design his dream Starfleet starship, but nearly fainted when he discovered that it would need to be bigger than size 12 to fit everything on...and that's without having ablative armor!

  5. #5
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    Originally posted by Greg Davis:
    Hey Steve, just out of curiosity, what's the one exception?
    The Starfleet Attack Fighter. And you get that in the Dominion War Sourcebook.


    Greg, who tried to design his dream Starfleet starship, but nearly fainted when he discovered that it would need to be bigger than size 12 to fit everything on...and that's without having ablative armor!
    Dude, you are dreaming too big.

    Steve Long


    [This message has been edited by Steve Long (edited 12-02-2000).]

  6. #6
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    I started to scribble some notes about the Akira class and realized that Spacedock has one problem- its too much. You have so many choices for each section that you MUST carefully plan your ship in advance.
    I forgot to address this before.

    I think you'll find that, once you become accustomed to using the rules, they're not as daunting as they first seem. That, and when we post the gaming aid forms, and other folx post their spreadsheets and programs and such, you'll find it even easier.

    Steve Long

    [This message has been edited by Steve Long (edited 12-02-2000).]

  7. #7
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by Steve Long:


    I think you'll find that, once you become accustomed to using the rules, they're not as daunting as they first seem. That, and when we post the gaming aid forms, and other folx post their spreadsheets and programs and such, you'll find it even easier.


    True. When I first skimmed through Spacedock I felt a little overwhelmed. I thought "It's becoming GURPS." Now, don't get me wrong, I love GURPS. It's the system I use in my campaigns, but the vehicle construction rules are engineering treatises in themselves. I don't need that. That's why I opted for LUGTrek system for space combat.
    However, after I designed the USS Highflyer with SD, that first impression changed. It does give you a lot of options, but I think that after two or three designs you get the hang of it and speed up the process. Although I agree that having a good idea of the ship before the design process helps a lot.



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  8. #8
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    Smile New Ships vs Canon Ships

    Well I finally got my SD all tucked away in plastic doc protectors and a nice white binder and sat down to read it.

    Whew! That's a whole lot of stuff!

    I started to scribble some notes about the Akira class and realized that Spacedock has one problem- its too much. You have so many choices for each section that you MUST carefully plan your ship in advance. If you're doing a new ship the number of choices are fine- just get to work and fill in that hull. If you're doing a canon ship, you had better carefully research her before cracking open SD. I can see where a spreadsheet will come in mighty handy. I can also see where several hours will go by while you put together your dreamship.

    All in all, I'm going to try to build a Valkyrie from Star Trek: Invasion first. A small ship will give me confidence with the system as well as fill a niche in our game.

    How about the rest of you? Are you discovering this as well?

    To Steve: Excellent work. Exhaustive and Excellent. My helmet's off to you.

    ------------------
    "The best diplomat I know is a fully charged phaser bank" -Montgomery Scott

  9. #9
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    One thing I really appreciate with Spacedock is the number of choices for the level of things like sensors, transporters, etc. Pretty much every Starfleet ship built in recent years (Galaxy onwards) will have around the same levels of transporters, sensors (pretty much) and communications. Under standard LUG rules, this meant that it was difficult to "downgrade" systems effectively to represent older or non-Starfleet ships. The SD rules make it very easy to design a customized freighter for a R,R&R campaign.

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  10. #10
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    Although I agree that having a good idea of the ship before the design process helps a lot.
    Oh, definitely. That was why I started off Chapter Two with a brief essay on the design process. Thinking about what you want to do, and how to achieve that goal, always works out better in the end than just tearin' through picking all the best systems.

    As for ease of use: wait 'til you've written up, oh, 75 ships or so. You'll practically have some of this stuff memorized and can whip the designs out much quicker. Trust me, I know.

    Steve Long

  11. #11
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    Steve, let me congratulate you on a job well done! Please send my regards to Don also, on a superb layout!

    I just have one question: Is SD the largest of the three books, that way I can get a rough estimate on how many black ink cartridges I'll have to go through? I've printed out 128 of the 198 pages, and I've already gone through two cartridges, considering I have a Canon BJC-2110.

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  12. #12
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    I just have one question: Is SD the largest of the three books, that way I can get a rough estimate on how many black ink cartridges I'll have to go through? I've printed out 128 of the 198 pages, and I've already gone through two cartridges, considering I have a Canon BJC-2110.
    Ick! Bad toner cartridge! Bad!

    The precise word counts for the three books are in the FAQ Don posted, but roughly speaking, SPACEDOCK's about 132,000 words, the SRM is about 75,000 words, and the DWS about 98,000 words. However, I don't know how those lenghts will interact with Don's layout templates and such. For example, the DWS might fit into fewer laid out pages than you'd expect from the wordcount, because it has a lot fewer tables and charts than SD.

    Steve Long


  13. #13
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    Thumbs up

    Originally posted by Steve Long:
    [B]Guys, before you start making pages o' notes to do your very own Akira (or whatever), don't forget: the SHIP RECOGNITION MANUAL will be available soon. It already has all the canon 24th century Starfleet ships (with one exception). I've done all the paper-scribbling for you.
    Gotcha, Steve! Hope it won't be long though. The example of the Galaxy (uprated) gives a very good idea of how you're doing this, so I look forward to see how you make an Akira, a Norway, etc.

    Concerning the low end of the component scale. It seems that you can put some pretty hefty components (like warp engines, propulsion, and weapons) in a relatively small hull. It looks like my version of the Valkyrie is going to be a little powerhouse at under 30m.

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  14. #14
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    Quote:

    I just have one question: Is SD the largest of the three books, that way I can get a rough estimate on how many black ink cartridges I'll have to go through? I've printed out 128 of the 198 pages, and I've already gone through two cartridges, considering I have a Canon BJC-2110.

    I've got a Canon 4304: made it through the whole lot on a used black cartridge with plenty to spare. Must be one of the older Canon with the REALLY tiny ink tubs...

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