Statistics for Delta Quadrant Species

[Diamond]

I see your reasoning Mactavish. I guess our difference of opinion comes down to how strictly and sweepingly one enterprets "Kazon stole Trabe technology and, despite their ability to use it, have no real understanding of it."

However, upon closer reading of your disadvantage it looks not unreasonable for the way the Kazon have been depicted. But the Kazon get in fights are lot and are nomadic. My problem is that with only skills of 1(2) in technical skills they would run themselves out of starships in less than a generation. New starships are not built by amatures, even if they are following a strict design.

I enterpret "have no real understanding" more loosely, meaning they don't have anyone with Theoretical Engineering 4(5) [I may have the name slightly wrong, it's from Price of Freedom] or even Physical Science (Subspace physics) 2(4). But [in my enterpretation of things] they WOULD have propulsion engineering (warp) 2(3) or an exceptional Systems Engineering (weapons) of 2(4).

I would reflect this in the Kazon's ICON system stats by not including high-faluting theory skills in their templates, and giving them a lower intellect attribute.

However, I think in certain extreme cases your "Tech Inexpert" disad would be appropriate. For example, in Robotech the Zendreadie "the vending machine on deck 52 is malfunctioning, time to requisition a new starship" definetly had that advantage.

On the other hand, I feel I must dissent with regard to the Packleds. They had a low intellect stat AND a negative logic edge. In addition to being technically inept, they were easy to con, befuddled by their larger situation, had a very simple language. Their disad was not nearly so narrow. This is easily represented in the ICON system by their attributes.

[This message has been edited by Diamond (edited 04-10-2001).]

[calguard66]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by StyroFoam Man:
Uh-Oh, Some One Has Angered The All-Mighty Creator Of Trek-RPG.NET. Can we flame him to a crisp Don, just this once? PLEEEAAASSSE! </font>

Set phasers on "LIQUIFY".



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"I'd rather die standing than live on my knees..."
Shania Twain

[calguard66]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by mactavish:
I don't think that I'm being overly harsh on the Kazon at all. It's been said on numerous occasions that the Kazon stole Trabe technology and, despite their ability to use it, have no real understanding of it.

[This message has been edited by mactavish (edited 04-10-2001).]</font>

But that doesn't mean that they are _unable_
to understand it. I can only read/write/speak Americanized English. Doesn't mean I have the disadvantage "unable to learn other languages"...



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"I'd rather die standing than live on my knees..."
Shania Twain

[Diamond]

calguard66: BINGO.

[This message has been edited by Diamond (edited 04-10-2001).]

[mactavish]

The Kazon are perfectly capable of maintaining their ships and systems... just not especially well. The Kazon do not build their own ships; it's been said on numerous occasions that "everything the Kazon have, they stole from the Trabe."

Individual Kazon are certainly free to buy off the Disadvantage and learn the Engineering (and similar) Skills at higher levels.

Assigning the Kazon a lower Intellect and a Logic penalty suggests that they are stupid, and it has been shown time and again that they are not. The Kazon are sly, cunning, devious, and capable of quick learning, as illustrated when Seska taught several Kazon warriors to steal specific components, use the transporters, and sabotage them so that Voyager's crew couldn't follow... all without a working model with which to practice.

The Disadvantage is meant to illustrate that, regardless of their intelligence, the character (or species) is presently incapable of understanding the "how" of their technologies' workings. If a PC Kazon spent time studying with an engineer (or similar expert), that would certainly validate buying off the Disadvantage.

As for the Kazon expertise with the Energy Weapon Skill, it is my belief that this is accurate as every single Kazon we've seen has carried and used an energy pistol or rifle. This is an integral part of Kazon training, starting at a very early age.

We've also seen the Kazon proclivity for knives, so perhaps the Energy Weapon (Disruptor) Skill could be swapped with the Primitive Weaponry (Knife). In that case, I'd work out an Overlay that accurately portrays the training (including the Energy Weapon Skill) that all Kazon males undergo.

I think that I'm going to work on a longer supplement for the Kazon, including new Ads and Disads, Overlays, and other stuff. I'll post it when I finish for anyone that's interested.

mactavish out.

[Centurion Noctis]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Assigning the Kazon a lower Intellect and a Logic penalty suggests that they are stupid, and it has been shown time and again that they are not.</font>

Not stupid, but not really logic either... a little bit like the klingon... Kazon are clever... so do the Kligon.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">As for the Kazon expertise with the Energy Weapon Skill, it is my belief that this is accurate as every single Kazon we've seen has carried and used an energy pistol or rifle. This is an integral part of Kazon training, starting at a very early age.</font>

This is part of Kazon training.. yea... so every Overlay for the Kazon should include Energy Weapon, but not the basic Template. Youre confusing Overlay and Template. Why a Kazon Scientist or a kazon Historian should know how to fire Disruptor ?

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Im french so I can pronounce Jean-Luc Picard

[Centurion Noctis]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Energy Weapon (Disruptor) 2 (3)</font>

I must disagree with the Energy Weapon thing in the template... i dont see why every single Kazon whoul know how to shoot Distuptor... Template are suppose to be for the whole race... If you look carefully the template in the book, theres no Personnal Equipment, Energy Weapon, and this kind of thing...

Andorian know how to use Chaka, but its a weapon of ritual, its plausible that every Andorian know how to manipulate it. But every kazon know how to fire Disruptor ? I dont think so...

Deltan are of the best navigator, will you give them Shipboard System (Fligth Control) ?

====================
Species Template: Kazon


Attributes
===========================
Fitness 2 [5]
Strength +1
Vitality +2
Coordination 2 [5]
Intellect 2 [5]
Logic -2
Presence 2 [5]
Empathy -1
Willpower +1
Psi 0 [5]

Skills
===========================
Athletics (choose two Specialization) 2 (3) and (3)
Unarmed Combat (choose Specialization) 2 (3)

Culture (Kazon) 2 (3)
History (Kazon) 1 (2)
Language, Kazon 2
World Knowledge (Homeworld) 1 (2)

Typical Advantages/Disadvantages
===========================
High Pain Threshold +2
Bloodlust -2

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Im french so I can pronounce Jean-Luc Picard

[Dan Gurden]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Centurion Noctis:
This is part of Kazon training.. yea... so every Overlay for the Kazon should include Energy Weapon, but not the basic Template. Youre confusing Overlay and Template. Why a Kazon Scientist or a kazon Historian should know how to fire Disruptor ?

</font>

Well the on-screen evidence suggests otherwise... In the Voyager episode where Chakotay teams up with Nog.. Um I mean the Kazon Kid, it is clearly shown that the Kazon teach all their children to be Warriors, and how to fight... Especially with energy weapons, which even the children carried...

Now while we have never seen a Kazon Historian and Scientist (Which I personally feel would most likely translate as Clan Storyteller and Trabe Slave... The second one of those is also from on screen evidence, but far more loosely), they are still raised equally with the other children thus would have the same background.

A non- screen reason to support this is the Kazons base social comment. They were designed as a parralel to the Inner city gangs, most specifically LA's Gangs, with colours and the like...
And in the base material there can be no denying that the 12 year old kid with an Uzi is likely to develop a skill with the machine gun should he survive long enough...

So I personally support the original template, Your mileage may vary, and that is of course your right... But those are my reasons for not having a problem with the template having a weapon skill...


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Dan.

"A couple of thoughts from a random mind!"

[Centurion Noctis]

Not all Kazon are engage in their little Space Army... We only see the military in the episodes

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Im french so I can pronounce Jean-Luc Picard

[SIR SIG]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Centurion Noctis:
Not all Kazon are engage in their little Space Army... We only see the military in the episodes

</font>

Yes but they are a militaristic/agressive/have a bone to pick species in general.

That in its self leads to a warrior culture.

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'...The Borg have stopped at deck 10...'
'...Deflector Control, no vital systems...'

Not a vital system! What the heck do you think stops the ship going 'poof' every time it goes to warp?

- ST:First Contact; Lt Hawk

[Centurion Noctis]

Yes, but Kligon and Cardassian are militaristic... Every single Klingon we saw on TOS was able to fire disruptor... but they dont get that in their Template.

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Im french so I can pronounce Jean-Luc Picard

[mactavish]

Centurion Noctis said:

"...Every single Klingon we saw on TOS was able to fire disruptor... but they dont get that in their Template."

That's because we later learned in the films, TNG, and DS9 that the Klingons are not ALL warriors. There are Klingon scientists, engineers, and so forth.

The comment has been made that the Klingons and Andorians have Primitive Weaponry as a part of their Templates. That's because they are raised where those weapons are an integral part of their culture. Energy Weapons are NOT a cultural thing for Klingons or Cardassians. For the Kazon, however, the disruptor is an integral part of their culture. We've seen it over and over again.

Regardless, if you want the Kazon to have a Skill other than Energy Weapon (Disruptor) as part of their Template, then change it.

Along the same lines as the Klingons, the Kazon are a warrior culture. Unlike the Klingons, however, the Kazon do not have a long history of honorable combat and a culture steeped in ancient mythology. The history of the Kazon was apparently lost as the majority of their memories revolve around enslavement and victimization by the Trabe. It's something that apparently went on for decades.

The Kazon are brutal, nomadic barbarians that wander through several sectors of space in stolen spaceships like an entire race of pirates. For this reason, most of the Packages I've been working on are closely related to such a lifestyle (ala Raiders, Renegades, and Rogues).

The entire Kazon culture is based on fighting, victimizing the weak, and idolizing (or fearing/hating) the strong. They are brutes... cunning brutes, perhaps, but brutes nonetheless. Even the sharpest Kazon have been shown as near-sociopathic warmongers, full of conceit and greed.

They are meant to be a "second class race" of thugs and hooligans in comparison to the Federation and other "civilized" cultures. They are fairly new to the galactic scene (at least on their own) and are still finding their place in space.

The Kazon are "young" as a species. They have yet to put aside their differences and make a home for themselves. Dan has said that they are modeled on 20th century Los Angeles gangs, with each sect having their own colors and manner of dress, their own rites and rules, and even their own turf (planets and starships). They exist in a constant state of gang war... they have few redeeming features. This is what makes the Kazon so interesting to me.

mactavish out.

[This message has been edited by mactavish (edited 04-11-2001).]

[mactavish]

What do you think about this idea..?

I've been planning a Delta Quadrant campaign set a couple of centuries in the future (c.2742) where many of the species have formed a federation of their own based on ideas left over from Voyager's passage many years earlier. The Kazon (wiser and considerably more civilized) are one of the leading member races, along with the Ocampa, the Phage-free Vidiians, the Talaxians, some Hirogen, some photonic lifeforms (including Kejal, the Cardassian hologram from "Flesh and Blood"), and several others. Even several worlds of the former Krenim Imperium have joined.

The player characters would all be from Delta Quadrant races.

Their main enemy species is the Vaadwaur, the race of aliens that slumbered beneath their homeworld's surface for 900 years before their release by the Voyager crew. The Borg Collective (under new management) is also a recurring foe, though the Borg are considerably less of a threat than they were in the 24th century. Some of the "free Borg" actually allied themselves with the coalition of federated races.

The United Federation of Planets would figure into this campaign, too, but as more of a neutral thrid party. The UFP and Starfleet have evolved considerably and are beginning to form the very beginnings of the Timefleet, equipped with transwarp drives and other cool advances. They maintain their Prime Directive and try not to "contaminate" the Delta Quadrant Confederation (or whatever it's called), but are still able to intercede and [covertly] offer their assistance if things get too out of hand.

What do you think?

mactavish out.

[Dan Stack]

I like it, but I would make one big change. Obviously it would depend on the players, but I would try to find a way to make humanity a common player race - it gives players a frame of reference. This is in my opinion, beyond budgetary reasons, the reason why we'll never see a Klingon-only Star Trek show. Perhaps the humans from the '37s can be a major member of this government. And the Voth, a possibility for some interesting conflict, the two children of Earth. Although the Voth seemed a tad to xenophobic to be part of any such government, but a lot can change over the centuries...

[mactavish]

Okay, here's a little more about hte Kazon. It's based mainly on what we've seen on screen, but I've taken a few liberties:

The history of the Kazon race is brief but violent. Originally a pre-industrial agrarian people, they were relocated en masse to the Trabe homeworld nearly two centuries earlier. Once there, the Kazon were enslaved, forced to live in ghetto-like camps, encouraged by their Trabe masters to fight amongst themselves to prevent an uprising against their subjugators. The history of the Kazon prior to their enslavement has long since been lost.

Approximately three decades ago (c.2340), a charismatic Kazon leader named Jal Sankur united the factions and overthrew their oppressors, slaughtering them by the thousands. They drove the Trabe from their home planet, condemning them to become a race of nomads, never allowing them to find a new home. The Kazon alliance quickly collapsed and nearly two dozen petty warlords seized as many of the remaining Trabe vessels and other resources as possible and leave the Trabe homeworld.

Several of these Kazon rulers, called majes, were genuinely charismatic leaders and managed to secure a large following. Others were merely opportunists with no true leadership qualities; they maintained their positions through ruthless violence and fear.
Having no true understanding of the technologies that they had acquired from their former masters, the Kazon sects constantly warred amongst themselves, fighting for the resources to keep their peoples satiated and to keep themselves in power.

Presently there are eighteen active Kazon factions. Among the largest and most powerful of these sects are the Kazon-Ogla, the Kazon-Relora, and the Kazon-Nistrim who, under the uninspired leadership of First Maje Jal Culluh and with the assistance of the Obsidian Order operative, Seska, managed to briefly seize control of the Federation starship U.S.S. Voyager. Other notable Kazon sects include the Kazon-Oglamar, the Kazon-Hobii (HO-bye), and the Kazon-Mostral.

The sects are all similar in their organizational hierarchy, each having a First Maje as their leader. Further, the chain of command is also identical in that when the First Maje dies, his lieutenant, or Second Maje, assumes his position as sect leader. Each Kazon sect has its own dress code, its own rites and rules, and controls its holdings with an iron fist.

Kazon males are trained as warriors from the time that they learn to walk. They are taught to fight with fist, knife, and disruptor. They are also trained in the ways of survival and guerilla warfare. Those fortunate enough to receive posting to a Kazon starship are also taught to operate one or more of its systems.

Kazon males, assuming they survive their training and the constant fighting with others in their sect, are renamed once they reach adulthood; they receive the prefix Jal to their name. So, for example, a Kazon boy called Ronar would, once successfully completing his training as a warrior, be renamed Jal Ronar. This is a sign of respect and honor among the Kazon, and all Kazon boys look forward to the day that they are named and can truly be called Kazon.

Kazon females are viewed with disdain and are strictly kept on the sects’ planetary holdings, primarily for breeding purposes. The Kazon males are known to be particularly abusive towards females in general, so it can be assumed that they are equally brutal toward their own.

Discipline among the Kazon is harsh. Even the slightest indiscretion is punishable by beatings or disfigurement. More heinous crimes are punished by execution. The most serious crime among the Kazon, betraying one’s sect, results in banishment. The banished Kazon, called a goven, is forced to wander alone, victimized by all other Kazon he encounters. Every time such an individual is caught by his fellow Kazon, he has one of his fingers cut off and is subsequently cast out once again. Those goven captured frequently enough eventually lose the use of their hands and quickly succumb to illness or starvation.

The Kazon sects have been known to own slaves despite their own history of subjugation by the Trabe. The Kazon-Ogla, for example, have captured several Ocampa when they breached the security of their subterranean complex and made their way to the surface.

The Kazon are brutal, nomadic barbarians. For the most part they wander through their space attacking those less powerful and stealing their resources. The Kazon have even been known to imprison and even execute their victims.

Despite their nomadic proclivities, some of the sects control moons, planets, and even entire solar systems. The Kazon-Mostral, Kazon-Nistrim, Kazon-Olga, and Kazon-Oglamar all control at least one planet, and possibly several others. The Kazon generally take control of uninhabited worlds, but have been known to occupy planets that have less advanced cultures than their own. Due to the nature of the Kazon, it is unlikely that a single sect could ever seize a planet occupied by a technologically advanced species, and even more unlikely that multiple sects would combine forces to do so.

Because they have been unwilling or unable to join together as a united people, the Kazon maintain their gang-like existence, constantly struggling to survive, living by victimizing the weak, fleeing from the strong, and constantly warring amongst themselves.


I've also been working on some Overlays and life packages and such. If you have any more information that I've missed, please let me know.

mactavish out.