Why not use Voyager BORG?

[Captain Zymmer]

I just watched BoBW last night on TNN's marathon and actually in that episdoe they walk around inside the cube for quite sometime with phasers, so the precendent is set.

As to the Endgame arguement, well I think that episode went way too far, but hey.

Species 8472 were the idea that there is always a bigger fish.

And why can't the good guys lose? Becuase they are heroes, they can be set back, but in the end the hero must previal. The is the staple of morality plays...now you can have the heroes win through great cost and sacrifice as Bob points out...and the Juggernaut parallel is excellent. I just wouldn't want to wipe out half my PCs in the process...for us we play to escape harsh reality...not be deafted after a day of working a bozo job or fighting with the spouse, or the other miriad of modern events that drive people's stress levels up.

Still like DanG says, to each our own game.

[Captain Zymmer]

Okay I think from here out I will use Voyager BORG, mixed with TNG Borg. Scary but not unstoppable...but no Queen, I really hated that idea and still do.

That said once they start an invasion of the Dominion I think I will take McTavish's idea and have them wipe each other out...for the most part, including Dominion suicide runs on their transwarp hubs and their home system/complex...a few subspace weapons should do the trick no?

[Paul]

I intend to intorduce the Borg in my next session purely as a short scenario plot-device: the PCs will be on their Cadet Cruise at/during Wolf 359.

There will be no direct interaction with the brg for the PCs, although I might have a drone or two materialise on the PCs ship during the battle (there's nothing to say that didn't happen).

Basically, at Wolf 359 the PCs task will be to be scared, be heroic, act bravely, then get the hell out of there before their ship blows up...

[SIR SIG]

The only reason why Species 8472 got one up on the Borg. Was because the Borg couldn't adapt to something they couldn't assimilate. A major draw back in a society where assimilation is the primary source of information.

Still...a few rudimentry sensors wouldn't've gone astray

As to Borg in my games:

1 scout cube slightly more powerful then the PC's ship. Many crew assimilated including 1 PC.

A couple of 'echoes' to scare the PC's. ie Cubes along the RNZ scoping up things ala TNG 'NZ'.

A 'Q' ep with a alternate future encounter with 2 Cubes on the way to Wolf 359 (explain how the VOY ep with a cube of Wolf 359 assimilated crews)

Wolf 359 itself, PC's won but at great sacrifice and a alternate timeline was made.

Wolf 359 again in a time traveling ep to restore the timeline by the Prophets (PCs indirectly killed Sisko).

So all in all only 2 direct confrontations ( a 3rd indirectly).

[Captain Zymmer]

So far my players have only encountered the BORG once

Endgame Redux, where they were part of the fleet that tackled the BORG cube...a whole lot of ships got destoryed and theirs was badly damaged...1 cube came through and then Voyager and Farscape, then Lexington (PCs ship), Voyager and Farscape force closed the conduit, causing the 14 cubes inside to go kabluey!

Can't remember which Voayger Ep as that bit where they get readings of hundreds of BORG and then it is the debris that rolls out.

It should also be pointed out that I did not use Timetravel Janeway with extra tech in this ep.

[Lancer]

My main problem with the Voyager BORG has never been the fact that Voyager could beat them, but all those little pieces of background about the Borg the show introduced without ever really eplaining anything.
Every Borg episode showed us some new aspect of their "society", but never showed us how all these elements fit together or how the Borg came to be in the first place (unless I missed some vital info - haven't watched Voyager much from mid-6th season on).

What shouldn't have changed between TNG and VOY is not that you can't beat the Borg, it's the emotionless and alien way of the Borg. That's what really made them frightening to me and it's something that Voyager did away with with all the "social interactions" they had with the Borg.

[Captain Zymmer]

Lancer I couldn't agree with you more

In my game the BORG are the relentless kind...no queen, no solcializing...none of that...just single minded expansion.

You can't reason with them
You can't scare them
You can't bribe them
They are the BORG
Resistence Is Futile

[Capt Daniel Hunter]

I don't see any reason why you can't use either.

Myself, I also tend to avoid using the Borg much. And when I do, it tends to be as a threat, rather than as a one on one confrontation. The last time we used, 'em, it was as a rapidly approaching threat, while the crew tried to wipe out all traces of Omega from a planet with a ruined civilisation, populated by the primitive descendants of that civilisation. If they didn't finish in time, not only would the Borg et their hands on new Omega reasearch, but also on our crew and their ship. It provided a real sense of tension.

[Phantom]

The only thing that got watered down in Voy. was the power of their ships. Face to face in the corridors they were still as terrifying as in TNG.