America's (And the Worlds) Payback -Part 1

[Capt.Hunter]

BTW, those "environmentalist wackos" have a point. I'm not saying we need to give up cars or high technology, but we do need to be a lot more careful with the environment. Americans certainly don't need the three or four cars per family they seemed to have when I was out there last year. We make do with one or two at most over here. As a point about American "isolationism", the US policy regarding environmental treaties has earned them a bad name in Europe. I'll agree the Kyoto Protocol was flawed, but the American response - "Look at India, they produce much more environmental waste than we do!" kind of rubbed people up the wrong way. Particularly people who actually stopped to realize that there are ten times as many people living in India, and on a per head basis the average American produces nearly ten times as much waste.

It doesn't make you a wacko to be concerned about the environment - it's just that the wackos are the only ones who get media coverage.

[dimeboy99]

How did we go from "Dubya" to Kyoto?

I'd be perfectly happy to defend the US's correct bipartisan decision (meaning both the industrial Republicans and the environmental Democrats) not to ratify the flawed, touchy-feely politically correct Kyoto Accord. But this is the wrong thread.

[Eric R.]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Capt.Hunter
[B]Americans certainly don't need the three or four cars per family they seemed to have when I was out there last year. We make do with one or two at most over here. /[b][Quote]

First on the surface I tend to agree however most Americans work 10, 20 30, even 50 miles from were they work. We have 0 in the way of public tranist like Europe does, no hoping a train to he burbs and even if you do your still likily to be driving some distance. Most families are not in the position to say here take the car for the day while were stuck at home, usually 5 or 10 miles from stores, schools and etc.... Hence the need for two cars. Alot of families also buy a Family car or the one which is used to take the whole clan to the restaurant. Or add in the fact most children live at home now till their mid twenties see how those 3 or 4 cars get used. Now were we dropped the ball big time was in letting public tranist go by the way side so that more Americans would buy more cars.

[Capt.Hunter]

Aah, now this makes a tad more sense. I'll admit the main places I visited in the US had pretty good public transport (San Diego for one). Still, I was amazed when a friend who lived in the States for three years told me of the American concept of the "throwaway car" - that if you break down on the Interstate it's easier to walk in to the next town and buy a new car than pay for a tow. Is there much truth to this? Over here, any decent car (ie: that isn't a deathtrap) is still a pretty major investment for the average earner.

I may move to the States soon. It's about the only way I'll make any decent money out of my career (molecular biologist) without hawking my eternal soul to a company...

[Dan Stack]

Cheaper to buy a new car than tow it? I've never heard that in my entire life - I think your friends are pulling your leg... A car is indeed a big investment - a new small sub-compact costing in the twelve to fifteen thousand range and a mid-size being in the upper teens, low twenties. That is a pretty huge investment. A used car does save some money, but often with a higher maintenance cost. Some people I know will only buy new, others only used.

When I was growing up, both my parents worked and therefore we had two cars. When I was in college we got a third car for me to get to my co-op job (a sort of paid internship in college, taking a semester off to work in industry).

Some wealthy people have a spare "toy" car but that is far from normal. Most families I know have two cars, sometimes (but not always) getting a third as the children get old enough to drive.

[Capt.Hunter]

This may be a factor: the people my friend hung around with were senior college staff. Over here, they get paid peanuts - I'm told it's different over there. This particular case does sound like the "toy car" concept you discussed.

[REG]

BTW, those "environmentalist wackos" have a point. I'm not saying we need to give up cars or high technology, but we do need to be a lot more careful with the environment. Americans certainly don't need the three or four cars per family they seemed to have when I was out there last year.

That depends. Both parents may work at different job sites. And it is difficult not to look at a teenaged daugther's puppy eyes and say "I don't care if you have a driver's license, and I don't care if this puts a crimp on your high school social life. You can't have a car to drive you to school and work."

What we need to do is find alternative energy sources besides fossile fuel. But every time we want to, car manufacturers and petroleum companies keep shutting those plans down.

But recently we did make baby steps, in producing electric-gas hybrid car.

[Aldaron]

Originally posted by REG

That depends. Both parents may work at different job sites. And it is difficult not to look at a teenaged daugther's puppy eyes and say "I don't care if you have a driver's license, and I don't care if this puts a crimp on your high school social life. You can't have a car to drive you to school and work."

What we need to do is find alternative energy sources besides fossile fuel. But every time we want to, car manufacturers and petroleum companies keep shutting those plans down.

But recently we did make baby steps, in producing electric-gas hybrid car.

If we didn't need oil, I think things in the Mid-East would change dramatically. I suspect most Western nations would largely advocate simply pulling out and letting the various groups (Israelis, Palestinians, Sunnis, Shi'ites, Iraq, etc) just fight it out between themselves.

[Captain Blake]

Originally posted by Capt.Hunter
Still, I was amazed when a friend who lived in the States for three years told me of the American concept of the "throwaway car" - that if you break down on the Interstate it's easier to walk in to the next town and buy a new car than pay for a tow. Is there much truth to this? Over here, any decent car (ie: that isn't a deathtrap) is still a pretty major investment for the average earner.

Actually, I've heard of/seen the concept. You go find a car that you can buy for less than a thousand dollars, preferably $500 or so. Usually, this is a trashy old beater, with big holes, a nasty engine/transmission, and a crappy interior.

You'll end up with a car with a lot of problems. So, it helps if you've got minimum mechanic qualifications.

You put the minimum possible insurance on the car, and drive it until it breaks.

With the cost of modern car repair (it just cost me 200 dollars to get the distributor replaced on my car, it took 15 minutes. AAA covered the towing) any real repairs are going to cost more than the car is worth.

Hence, when it breaks, you buy another one, just like the old one.

Continue until you have money to buy a real car.

This is more commonly used in the rural areas, rather than in most cities.

As a note, when I was in high school, we had 3 drivers, and 6 cars.

Mom's Car, Dad's Truck, The Snowplow, The Van for Trips, The Flatbed Hauling truck, the VW dad was fixing, and my car.

Alex

[Gaunt_Man]

Originally posted by Dan Stack
I watched it - I thought it was important to hear what he says since there are a lot of loonies out there who think he's some sort of righteous dude who.

I think he's evil.

I agree.

The thing that frightens me most about bin Laden, is that he doesn't LOOK evil (as in all the evil villains in movies). I'm afraid to say this, but before I saw the most recent (I believe) video of him, with his speech, etc, he certainly didn't look the part. He looked... peaceful, incapable of doing what he's done.

To fit his actions, he should look something like Palpatine in <I>Return of the Jedi</I>. But he doesn't.

That scares me.

May the God of all religions protect the US and UK troops trying to bring down the Taliban and capture (or kill) Osama bin Laden, as well as the innocents on all sides.

Amen.

[Capt.Hunter]

Someone over here who'd met Bin Laden was asked if "he seems a formidable, impressive figure". The guy replied that instead "he seems a lot like a bank manager".

I think that scares me more.

[calguard66]

Originally posted by Capt.Hunter
Still, I was amazed when a friend who lived in the States for three years told me of the American concept of the "throwaway car" - that if you break down on the Interstate it's easier to walk in to the next town and buy a new car than pay for a tow. Is there much truth to this? Over here, any decent car (ie: that isn't a deathtrap) is still a pretty major investment for the average earner.

Cheaper to buy another than tow the old one... no.

However it is often better in the long run to buy another car rather than fix the old one.

[calguard66]

Originally posted by Captain Blake


As a note, when I was in high school, we had 3 drivers, and 6 cars.

Mom's Car, Dad's Truck, The Snowplow, The Van for Trips, The Flatbed Hauling truck, the VW dad was fixing, and my car.

Alex

Hmmm... We had my mom's Camero, My dad's Chevy pickup, my brother's '57 Chevy, my '63 T-bird, the family motorhome... and 4 motorcycles.