How far will they go?

[Becker]

I had a quick thought about Vulcans - how far will they take logical thought? How about some kind of cult who have decided that the only logical course of action is to wipe out all other forms of life in the Universe.
Obviously this is an impossible task, and for the most part, the cult is rejected out of hand. However, when they set off a neutron bomb/molecular disassembler/weapon of mass destruction in the middle of a crowded area on Vulcan/Earth/really central world, Starfleet must take action.
PC's ship is dispatched to hunt down the cult, which has made its home on a hijacked Vulcan science vessel, outfitted with some kind of illegal weaponry.
Either the ship is destroyed, or not, but either way the PC's must still find and stop the charismatic leader of the cult, who is a master of disguise, and uses his psychic abilities to cloud people's minds so that they trust him.
He has promised to set off another bomb or whatever by a certain time, thus giving the PC's a limited amount of time to track him down and stop the atrocity. What do you think?

[EliasVaughn]

Well, obviously, this cult is illogical. Undertaking an endevour that is impossible is an extrarodinary waste of resources. However, the cult doesn't have to realize this; if you are already illogical, it is quite simple to ignore your own illogic.

[Didymus]

If the cult scales down its goals, it might revert back into the Logic ballpark. The Way of Kolinahr(sp?) does talk about Vulcans taking logic downdofferent paths. Take the Vulcan Isolationist Movement who determined quite logically that "aliens" were corrupting the Vulcan people and they want, logically, to cut off all outside relations and exit from the Federation.

And then you have Valeris from ST:IV who logically determined that peace with the Klignons was a Bad Thing(tm) and was part of an assassination conspiracy.

Logic can go all over the place, you just have to make sure that it would be logical to at least all the members of the terror organization that you plan to use.

Sir Didymus

[qerlin]

The problem is with the definition of logic. Logic is "the science of reasoning, proof, thinking, or inference..." (OED, 1986) Logic allows you to examine a problem, but if your internal set of data begins with errors, those errors will effect the outcome of the processed data.

The cult, depending on the input they use (terrible stuff done by other races, the inevitability of death, whatever) might lead them to believe that a certain group(s) needs detroyed. Like most Vulcans, the logic is probably top-notch...but their data is flawed or incomplete.

I think the VUlans would try to get to the group first, before Starfleet. I think they would try to reason with them, and barring success there, they wold destroy them -- logically, it would be necessary to preserve the safety of the masses, as well as the honor of the Vulcans. Besides, there's that privacy thing -- Vulcans like to keep things in-house. So you might have the V'Shar up against the PC's as well...same goal, stop these guys, but working at cross-purposes. (Welcome to bureaucratic politics...)

[First of Two]

A "logical" conclusion always rests on the truth of its premises.

You can reason perfectly logically, but if your original assumption is incorrect, your conclusion probably will be as well.

Therefore, it is easy to imagine a logician or group of logicians, reasoning from what they THINK are true premises, reaching a disastrous conclusion, because one of their basic assumptions is incorrect.

[jokes about examples being theology and marxism deleted]

[tonyg]

Thing thing about logic is that it leave a lot of "room to maneuver" because it all depends on what motivations you have.

Any logical belief suystem falls back on making illogical assumptions. For instance even the concept of "the needs of the many outweight the needs of the few" is based on the belief that somone want's a species to survive. Wanting something (desire) is an emotinal response.

All logical thought leads back to why, and then to a desire.

[AslanC]

Logic is a pretty wreath of flowers that smell bad...



Seriously, I think everyone has said it best, Logic is not an absolute, it is a form of reasoning. The point is to figure out what motivates the logic.

A corporate raider has his own logic for downsizing and cutbacks while a Greenpeace activist may also have their own set of logic, and the twain may never meet.

[Lord Kjeran]

Rocket ships are exciting
But so are roses on a birthday.

Computers are exciting
But so are roses on a birthday.

And logic will never replace Love.

Sometimes I wonder where I belong
In the future or in the past.

I guess I'm just an old-fashioned Spaceman.

From Warmed By Love by Leonard Nimoy. Boulder, Co.: Blue Mountain Press, 1983. OOP.

<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...696675-7434309>

[Captain Leana Craig]

Or as Spock said to Valaris in ST:VI...

"Logic is the beginning of wisdom"

or something along those lines

[Shoshuro]

Vulcan main philosophy though is Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combnations (IDIC). No sane vulcan would do it for the simple reason that it destroys those combinations and even then (to me) would take them back to their Romulan roots of "I don't like what your doing, I'll destroy you."

I agree though that most would find it illogical for the simple reason that it is a waste of time and resources.

As for Valaris...I think her big thing was that she saw the Klingon's as un-enlightened savages who would rather destroy themselves then try to recieve help. After all, they were even plotting against themselves.

IMHO though I think they should've stuck with Saavik joining the conspieraters(sp).

[CmdrBluejeans]

The character I play on AnomalyMUX (blatant plug for Anomaly here) is an Andorian whose primary beef with Vulcans is that it always boils down, for most of them, to "Anything with which I disagree is illogical."

Or, more precisely, as I-as-Akeen Ghorev once said "If I find one more Borva-damned Vulcan who somehow, despite claiming a virtual hammerlock on the concept, doesn't seem to realize that logic is a *process* and not a *product*, I'm going to stuff him into a probe casing and launch him on a one way journey to the Great Barrier."

And that, I think, is precisely where most Vulcans, as they appear onscreen or in-most-games, are played 'incorrectly'. We as players and fans are too quick to paint a combination of cool emotional detachment and intellectual gamesmanship as 'logic', when in fact logic *is* a series of steps one takes to arrive at Point B from Point A.


BJ

[Silverthorne]

"thats not Logical" says the pointy eared Elf.... then BOL




sorry had too..