A few questions for those that have most of the ICON & CODA stuff

[Warduke]

1, Overall, which system is the better and what makes it better?

2, If I decide to go with Coda, which Icon books should I pick up, and which are redundant (since perhaps some books info now are part of the Player's or Game masters books)?

3, I have only the TNG book for Icon, how much of the info is used in the Original Trek RPG book? Just an approx, you don't have to count the letters.

4, Any Icon books that I definately should stay away from?

[Phantom]

Originally posted by Warduke
1, Overall, which system is the better and what makes it better?

2, If I decide to go with Coda, which Icon books should I pick up, and which are redundant (since perhaps some books info now are part of the Player's or Game masters books)?

3, I have only the TNG book for Icon, how much of the info is used in the Original Trek RPG book? Just an approx, you don't have to count the letters.

4, Any Icon books that I definately should stay away from?

1) This is subjective. I like the ICON system a lttle more because you build your character from the ground up, I like that sense of history. I really can't say one is overall better then the other, they both have their good and bad sides.

2) Again it all depends what you want. CODA is a good stand alone game, if you want a little more character detail I would say the two species books are a good choice to pick up. The other books? Pick up what is related to your story...ie RRR if you are running a 'pirate' type game, SF Intel if you are running a spy game, etc.

3) The general game system is repeated as well as some of the early history of the universe.

4) IMO, no. They were all well done books. The problem now is can you still get your hands on them.

[KillerWhale]

Hi Warduke,

I own all LUG and CODA stuff, so I hope I can help

1, Overall, which system is the better and what makes it better?

My players and I prefer CODA over ICON because...
1. Character development is more diverse, you have more goals and funky abilities that make a character truly unique;
2. CODA is less "rough" (difficulties range from 0 to 25, against 0 to 15 in ICON).

2, If I decide to go with Coda, which Icon books should I pick up, and which are redundant (since perhaps some books info now are part of the Player's or Game masters books)?

Depends on the era, campaign, if you are a player or narrator etc... Can you tell us more?

4, Any Icon books that I definately should stay away from?

Well, the base rulebooks are a bit redundant with the background covered in the PG and NG - and the ICON mechanics won't interest you. Apart from that, all ICON books are really fine material.

[qerlin]

I like 'em both, but we prefer CODA. CODA "builds your character from the ground up" just like ICON and all the ICON stuff, with a little work, ports over into CODA fine. They also have much better narrator tools in CODA's Narrator's Guide -- rules for ship, world, sector, alien, and creature building.

I'd suggest CODA, myself, though the product support seems lackluster -- if it even exists. I'd strongly suggest the ICON products for the Vulcans and Andorians, the Romulan set was good, too. Strongly suggest you pick up the Star Carts book that also recently came out (not a game product).

[Warduke]

"Depends on the era, campaign, if you are a player or narrator etc... Can you tell us more? "

Well, I'm the narrator to get that out of the way. I plan to run a campaign set a year or so after Voyager's return, which is still some 20 or so episodes away here in Sweden. Since most of my players are working out of town I just have 2 regular players so I plan to do like the Star Wars Darkstryder campaign and have the players have 2 characters each, two ensigns and two bridge crew officers.

For my first season I plan two run about 20 apisodes with half being the ensigns last year at the academy and half being the bridge crews last year aboard an ageing vessel (undecided class) and within Federation space.

Then the second season is where the game really starts when they are all assigned aboard a new Galaxy ship fitted with some of Voyagers new technical breakthroughs and sent into the Delta Quadrant to find out what happen to two earlier expeditions.
Of course Starfleet aren't the only ones exploring the Quadrant, and the main threat the second season will be the Romulans.

[Ineti]

Originally posted by qerlin
I'd suggest CODA, myself, though the product support seems lackluster -- if it even exists.

Have some faith. More products are on the way, and as I understand it, Decipher is working on a new website arrangement that will support both RPGs.

Quality takes time.

[el queso]

1, Overall, which system is the better and what makes it better?

2, If I decide to go with Coda, which Icon books should I pick up, and which are redundant (since perhaps some books info now are part of the Player's or Game masters books)?

3, I have only the TNG book for Icon, how much of the info is used in the Original Trek RPG book? Just an approx, you don't have to count the letters.

4, Any Icon books that I definately shuld stay away from?

1) I would say CODA. It is a lot simpler, character creation is easy (despite page-flipping a lot of the time) and any system that emphasises roleplaying over roll-playing is great. Yes there are classes and there is a kind of pseudo-level system but don't worry. It's more like Alternity & D6 Star Wars than like d20. That said, if d20 was more like this I'd stop complaining to my conformist customers about the "kill things and take their stuff" pavlovian attitude that d20 (except for Spycraft) conditions the modern gamer into. Sorry. Rant mode off.

2) The TNG Player's Guide has a lot of good information about a day in the life of a Starfleet crewmember and a lot of odd obscure information. DS9's Raiders, Renegades & Rogues is a great source of ideas for non-Starfleet characters and antagonists. Holodeck Adventures is one my group want me to use but the adventures in it pretty much suck without major tweaking

3) A lot. To be honest I've only skimmed the Original Series book because so much of the system was repeated. Just replace the setting information, races & ships and you're pretty much there.

4) The Big Star Trek Book of Monkeys. I don't know why they did a book on monkeys, I think Brannon Braga once said they play a huge part in the backstory (powering the engines or something). That and the ICON TNG Core Book which had a naked centre-spread of Gene Rodenberry. Ewww...

Charlie E/N
(one of these answers may be a big fat lie. You can choose which)

[kjakan]

> 1, Overall, which system is the better and what makes it better?

CODA, I'd say. That's because I really did not like ICON at all. No offense intended.

The basic system was: roll 1D6 per Attribute point. Pick the highest. Add skill. Assuming a skill of 3, this yields a result of 4-9. Add in the Drama die (if this rolls a 6, use this and add the next highest die) for a result of 4-15.

I found the system to be to rough for my taste.

In comparison, CODA provides a wider range of results and the famous bell curve. Here you roll 2D6 and add the skill. Assuming a skill of 3, this gives you a result of 5-15. Though this may seem to be the same as above, note that the most common result on 2D6 is 7. The player and GM can be reasonably certain of the approximate result, yet the result vary enough to introduce the risk of failure.

Second, CODA handles combat better (in my opinion). Why is this important? Well, though combat is not necessarilly a fundamental part in ST, when it does occur, the players and GM are ill-served with quirky rules.


> 2, If I decide to go with Coda, which Icon books should I pick up, and which are redundant (since perhaps some books info now are part of the Player's or Game masters books)?

Any of the books are good. Though the system differs, it still lays out the options.

A simple conversion guideline - increase difficulty numbers by half, or use the CODA equivalent for named difficulties (such as "moderate"). Bonuses and penalties usually carry over straight.

> 3, I have only the TNG book for Icon, how much of the info is used in the Original Trek RPG book? Just an approx, you don't have to count the letters.

Setting information is just part of it. The best bit is the section on episode building. TOS has a very distinct feel the designers brought forward very well.

> 4, Any Icon books that I definately should stay away from?

None that spring to mind.

[KillerWhale]

Warduke,

Thanks for the precisions.

Given the elements your provided, I'd say you need the PG and NG for Coda. Then the following ICON products may interest you:

- Starfleet Academy boxed set (for your first season)
- The way of D'era boxed set (Romulan set)
- The price of freedom (plenty of ships and info about the UFP)

You may also be interested in
- Planetary adventures (independent eps ready to play)
- The price of Freedom (1st part of a campaign near the RNZ, but unfortunately we'll never see the 2nd part)
- Planets of the UFP (Lots of planetary systems with writeups and ep seeds)

[Warduke]

Thanks for all the advice people. I've just won some Icon books (Player's guide and Price of Freedom off of ebay for $10 (lost out on SF Academy for $6.5 since I couldn't watch the auction all the way through. Bummer, but all books are available where I live anyway although not that cheap.)) so I've started to expand my library.

I'll go with the new rules when the limited edition hits (I really want the Enterprise book/let) and buy a few of the old products as background info.

As long as I'm asking. Star Trekk Star Charts is a must buy as far as I'm concerned but which other non-RPG sourcebooks are good? (The Encyklopedia? Star Ship spotter? Others? )

I'll post my adventure seeds in the Narrator's ready room later.

[Ineti]

Originally posted by Warduke
As long as I'm asking. Star Trekk Star Charts is a must buy as far as I'm concerned but which other non-RPG sourcebooks are good? (The Encyklopedia? Star Ship spotter? Others? )

Star Charts is a great buy. You might also want to check out the Star Trek Encyclopedia (expanded and revised edition), the Star Trek Chronology, the Star Trek: Next Generation Technical Manual, and the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Technical Manual.

If you want insight as to how a series is made and developed over the years, I highly recommend the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Companion. It's a great read and a must-have for any fan of the series. IIRC, it's available from bn.com as one of their half-price deals.