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Thread: How do you figure beam weapon coverage?

  1. #1
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    How do you figure beam weapon coverage?

    Ok, we know that the number of beam weapons listed is not equal to the numbers given in "canon" sources but has to do with coverage; I assume this means things like firing arcs and amount of damage available in those arcs, much like the ICON ship stats gave one weapon and a firing arcs (often 720 degrees or some such). So...how do we figure these things out? This is one area where the ship design rules in the NG let me down a bit, as it seems this should have been mentioned, at least in simplified form. Since many of us want to build ships, it would be cool if we could have some guidance on this. I know Don said to halve the canon numbers as a rule of thumb, but it would be helpful to have an idea of number of weapons per firing arc or some such.

    Allen

  2. #2
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    The thing is, the starship combat system doesn't use firing arcs. The system in one-dimensional (i.e., how close you are to your target), so firing arcs are unnecessary.

    The only reason I've seen "coverage" mentioned is in determining how many beam weapons to include with the new system. For example, I've totalled up the sum of all of the arcs of a particular type of beam weapon, then calling each full 720 degrees of the total "one" beam weapon in Coda. The left over coverage also becomes "one" beam weapon (or, alternatively, I could say that would equal one beam weapon enhancement edge). Beyond that, there's no need to determine what arcs each weapon covers.
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  3. #3
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    Lightbulb

    Correct. No tactical layer, beyond range, no facing or heading considerations, hence, no “arcs.” All we’re concerned with is the amount of effective firepower a vessel can bring to bear. A Galaxy-class starship has twelve Type X phasers. How many times can you remember seeing them all fire at once? How about two simultaneously? Three?

    The presumption is that the vessel is maneuvering to bring their most effective weapons to bear. I think the PC computer game “Bridge Commander” illustrates this really well. You’re flying along and someone strafes you while you lock them up (primary target) and hold down the mouse button to fire. As the enemy moves from fore to aft, port to starboard, your arrays continue to fire, handing off from your forward saucer dorsal to your secondary hull, to the aft strip on your warp faring. In short, the enemy is always exposed to your weapons in some capacity.

    Now, my example was with a Galaxy-class, bristling with weapons and overlapping arcs of coverage. If we shrink the scale to something with less weapons, say an Oberth, this is accounted for in their lower penetration ratings. How? Because that vessel has fewer weapons and coverage, they are able to bring less firepower to bear. There are blind spots that an enemy can sneak into, hence why you take less damage. The entire concept around a vessel’s offensive value, generated by purchasing multiple arrays, is to represent this additional firepower that you’re able to use. Even though technically a ship is only being hit by one Type X phaser, the enemy takes more damage from a vessel with ten Type X phasers because they’re constantly exposed to multiple arrays of coverage.

    In short, the half canon number represents that effective firepower in trying to account for “blind spots.” If you were to match canon numbers over directly and add up offensive values then you’re saying that the vessels fire every weapon in every direction all the time. We all know that isn’t the case in Star Trek.

    I hope I’ve explained the reasoning behind the system as it stands. I’m sorry you’re disappointed that the NG didn’t handle this to your satisfaction.
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  4. #4
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    I don't think it's disappointment so much as confusion (presumably due to word count?)

    Your explanation of the effective firepower approach makes perfect sense, as does why you should use half the "canon number of emitters." The confusion comes about because that suggestion and those explanations are not present in the NG, which just leaves the uninformed making wild guesses as to what the firepower should be.

    A classic example is the b'rel-class scout - on screen we clearly see two disruptors and a torpedo tube every time it's in combat. The natural tendency is to build two mounts into the CODA version, but by this rule of thumb it should only have one (which makes sense, as they both fire forward) - which just looks... wrong!

    Add to this the fact that we have no idea, for example, how powerful a b'rel's disruptor is in comparison to a Type XI phaser, and I hope it becomes a little clearer as to the source of the confusion!

    If I might make one teeny after the fact (but hopefully constructive) comment, it might have been better to drop the offence value and space costs of the individual emitters by half, and double the number on the example ships. This would have had no impact on the gameplay, and moved the whole debate out of the public arena.

    Just my thoughts, and no reflection on the system, which I still say is one of the best I have seen in a non-dedicated book.
    Jon

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  5. #5
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    I'm very happy with the NG and with the ship construction system, I just was saying that there was no explanation of how to determine how many weapons to give your ship. Given this lack, someone who doesn't have access to this forum would just think "well this book says the Ridiculous Class has 20 Type X Phasers so I'll give it that much" and wind up with a ship that is..ahem...ridiculously overgunned for Star Trek

    I am thinking, based on things I've seen elsewhere that a theoretical maximum is:

    Beam Weapons Limit = Size number of beam weapons
    Missle Weapons Limit = Size X 2 number of missle weapons (I think Don mentioned this in an earlier thread).

    In most cases Starfleet vessels are not likely to have much more than half the ship's Size rating in any of these weapons, I would think.

    Allen

  6. #6
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    I know I'm going to kick myself later for getting involved in this discussion but here it goes.

    I do believe that firing arcs are an important part of starship combat. The TOS Enterprise has 2 or 3 pahser banks...all forward facing. When an enemy de-cloaks behind it, there's nothing to fire at the enemy. With an array, that becomes irrelevant...every part of the ship is covered. Perhaps a new tactical maneuver could be "Bring weapons to bear". It would require an extra phase of movement and could make combat more interesting.


    I've been working on the whole bank/cannon/array thing....

    For a bank or single mount, use the costs in the NG and figure things normally.

    For an array add half the ship size to the base cost and another 5 points of damage/offensive value, and then figure the rest normally.

    For a cannon, add 1-2 points to base cost and figure the total damage normally...when consulting the PV chart use the next higher level (or two), but only use the first two numbers as a cannon is a short range weapon.

    I've already built a small armada including the Reliant, a seriously Next-Gen'd Constitution Class and I even adjusted the Galaxy Class. This stuff works out nicely. If applied to all the ships in the NG, they even out...combat-wise. This also works well if you apply Don's "half the visible mounts" rule when converting blueprints.
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  7. #7
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    Post

    After reading the posts in this thread, I've decided to throw my dual copper Lincolns.
    This is one thing I always wondered about when looking at the system; if all the ship's weapons are combined into a single rating, its seems somewhat unnecessary to purchase individual weapon mounts. IMHO, it would seem easier to pay a certain cost per level of firepower for both beam and missile weapons. This would make it easier to rate a ships firepower. The various designations (Type X phaser, Type 10 disruptor) would be mostly a special effect.
    Another idea would be weapon-specific traits/flaws that modify a weapon's rating with various special effects (this was inspired by a similar mechanism in the Big Eyes, Small Mouth™ RPG).
    Finally, why not have a possible new flaw: "Arc Shadows" to account for blind spots in a ship's firepower?
    The best way to predict the future is to create it.

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by Highway Hoss
    Another idea would be weapon-specific traits/flaws that modify a weapon's rating with various special effects
    In the starships book.
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  9. #9
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    Wink

    Originally posted by Don Mappin
    In the starships book.
    For some reason, I'm starting to think "... next Tuesday" when I see this line
    (just joking - no offence intended whatsoever )
    "The main difference between Trekkies and Manchester United fans is that Trekkies never trashed a train carriage. So why are the Trekkies the social outcasts?"
    Terry Pratchett

  10. #10
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    Cool

    Originally posted by C5
    For some reason, I'm starting to think "... next Tuesday" when I see this line
    You and me both.
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    "In every revolution, there's one man with a pizza."
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