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Thread: ST authors 'lift' LUG trek details??

  1. #1

    ST authors 'lift' LUG trek details??

    Not sure if this is the best place for this post, but since it deals with Steve L's work, why not... Apologies if it's been noted elsewhere before...

    I finally got around to reading The Battle of Betazed, by Charlotte Douglas and Susan Kearney, and I came across a passage describing the Saber-class Light Cruiser, three of which cover the Enterprise-E's flanks during a raid against the Cardassian station orbiting Betazed. The wording seemed familair, so I read through the 'Saber' entries in Spacedock and The Price of Freedom and...bingo!

    On page 126 of The Battle of Betazed (emphasis mine to highlight key phrases):

    "The Saber-class vessels usually served as fast perimeter-defense ships in border regions. Presently guarding the Enterprise's flanks, the light cruisers had already proven their worth in extensive action on several fronts. Their captains and crews would take full advantage of their agile vessels' maneuverability, which had repeatedly allowed them to hold their own against much larger opponents in hostile frontier regions.
    The compact ships, with their crews of forty, saved weight and space through their internal nacelle configurations. The design feature made the vessels faster but also more vulnerable to full armor penetration and core breaches.."
    Now, compare the wording from the Price of Freedom writeup of the Saber-class, on page 141 (again, emphasis mine):

    "The fourth vessel to enter service as a result of the Perimeter Defence Directive, the Saber-class Light Cruiser has already seen extensive action on several frontiers ... the first Saber-class vessels were commissioned in late 2370 as fast perimeter-defense ships.

    Initially assigned to hostile frontier regions, these agile vessels quickly proved that they could hold their own against much larger opponents. The internal nacelle configuration, suggested by Cardassian embedded-wapr technology and employed by Starfleet R&D during the Defiant Project, makes the ship a compact target and saves additional wight and space that would otherwise be required for nacelle field conduits and containment structures. Of course, this design also makes these vessels more vulnerable to core breaches when full armor penetration occurs."
    Also note the authors' mention of a crew of forty for the Sabers, which matches the figure found in PoF and Spacedock, and the designation as a Light Cruiser (which I beleive first appeared in these LUG support products, not in anything canon or 'official'...

    So it seems that LUGTrek source material is, to some extwnt, now being adopted by ST authors in their "research". Kind validates all the hard work Steve's done on ST ship design, don't it? If onyl they'd acknowledged the source of said material rather than passing it off on their own words and creation...

  2. #2
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    It could easily be a case of "great minds think alike." But hey, if they're getting some use out of the books, I'm happy.
    Steve Long
    HERO System Line Developer

  3. #3
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    For what it's worth, the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Technical Manual lists the Sabre-class as a "light cruiser" with a crew of 40 officers and noncoms.

    I'm not sure if the Manual predates Steve's work, though. The DS9 Tech Manual was first published in 1998.

  4. #4
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    That's pretty wild.

    I wonder if the author is a "TrekRPGer?"
    Kronok

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  5. #5
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    The DS9TM definitely predates my work -- by almost exactly a year, IIRC.
    Steve Long
    HERO System Line Developer

  6. #6
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    Originally posted by Kronok
    That's pretty wild.

    I wonder if the author is a "TrekRPGer?"
    While I'd like to think so, I doubt it. The authors of the DS9 Tech Manual are Herman Zimmerman, Rick Sternbach, and Doug Drexler.

    Thought it would be sweet to find out of they're RPG fans.

  7. #7
    Okay, so maybe the authors of Battle of Betazed got ideas from the DS9 Tech Manual, but it seems WAY too coincidental that their wording virtually echoes a number of key phrases, phrases that do not appear in the DS9 TM 'snapshot' of the Saber-class. I'm pretty sure they had to have read Price of Freedom, though whether they did so as fans, or because it was pointed out to them as background source material, who knows....

  8. #8
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    Back in the day of WEG d6 Star Wars, writers who had been hired to write SW novels received a collection of RPG sourcebooks to use as background material. I wonder if that ever happens to ST writers.
    + &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;<

    Blessed be the Lord my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight. Psalm 144:1

  9. #9
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    No, it doesn't happen. Paramount keeps all its outside IP separate. Lucas, OTOH, generally considers game sourcebooks, novels, and so on "canon" unless and until they're contradicted on the screen, as I understand it.

    If you look in the Star Wars Encyclopedia, for example, you'll find RPG products, authors, and material listed. You'll find no such thing in the Star Trek Encyclopedia.
    Steve Long
    HERO System Line Developer

  10. #10
    Well, they should!

    After all, since Trek authors have to coordinate their work with Paula Block at Paramount, you'd think that all approved materials would be considered at least "semi-canon" until contradicted on screen. And, since (in my understanding) game companies have to purchase rights to use ST names, characters, and concepts, the same courtesy should be extended to them -- if it's licensed, it should be semi-canon -- again, until otherwise altered by 'official' materials.

    Regardless, it would've been nice to see an acknowledgement -- even something like "The Saber-class starship description on page 126 is derived from The Price of Freedom, a supplement to Last Unicorn Games' Star Trek: The Next Generation Roleplaying Game. The authors wish to thank the writers and developers of this sourcebook for their inspiration and dedication to keeping Trek alive."

    I've seen similar acknowledgements in novels based on TV or movie franchises, so it's not impossible.

    Anywho, enough ranting... we now return you to your regular Spacedock programming, already in progress.

  11. #11

    Talking

    Originally posted by Knightsfyre001

    Regardless, it would've been nice to see an acknowledgement -- even something like "The Saber-class starship description on page 126 is derived from The Price of Freedom, a supplement to Last Unicorn Games' Star Trek: The Next Generation Roleplaying Game. The authors wish to thank the writers and developers of this sourcebook for their inspiration and dedication to keeping Trek alive."

    But woul;dn't inserting that acknowledgement ruin the narrative???
    DanG/Darth Gurden
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  12. #12
    I'm talking about an acknowledgment in an Author's Notes or Acknowledgemnts page at the front of the book. Some books even have whole pages dedicated to one sentence indicating where the story takes place relative to certain episodes/events in 'canon' chronology. With a lot of pace left on that page, they coulda put it there.

    Anyway, enough beating a dead horse -- on with the ship designs!!!!

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