Murdering b@$+@&ds...

[Evan van Eyk]

Originally posted by calguard66
if you want to make war, come ahead... it's just business.

Definitely not meant offensively, but as long as people think like that, there won't be any changes. As long as war is just business, for some people, there will be those who fight them.
As you said yourself, one time every country is defeated, which is why I think we should throw ideas of national security and interest overboard and finally put ourselves together and realize that we live together on that planet and while we can make our lives miserable a lot we can do the opposite as well - together.
We have to form a unity from which we can encounter any threats of natural occurances. There are enough dangers, posed by hunger, deseases... we do not need to add war.

[Dan Stack]

Originally posted by Evan van Eyk
You misunderstood Hunter, he spoke of taking land, not oil.

Why do you say that?

[calguard66]

Quite the opposite. Until people quit becoming emotionally attached to conflicts, as with Israel and the Arabs, war will never cease.

You can only negotiate with a rational person or people. People wrapped up in the emotions of a situation are not rational.

As for setting aside national security and interest... you go first.

Originally posted by Evan van Eyk
Definitely not meant offensively, but as long as people think like that, there won't be any changes. As long as war is just business, for some people, there will be those who fight them.
As you said yourself, one time every country is defeated, which is why I think we should throw ideas of national security and interest overboard and finally put ourselves together and realize that we live together on that planet and while we can make our lives miserable a lot we can do the opposite as well - together.
We have to form a unity from which we can encounter any threats of natural occurances. There are enough dangers, posed by hunger, deseases... we do not need to add war.

[C5]

Originally posted by calguard66
As for setting aside national security and interest... you go first.

And here is the problem. If we start chanting peace and love or make love not war, while some other beings are busily building an army, we are in great danger of being stamped upon.
OTOH, if we say that we have to keep a strong army because there are dangerous guys out there and so on, then this situation will never evolve and will be the same in some hundred years (only the weapons may evolve).
As always, the answer lies in the middle, but the middle is always hard to find.

[Evan van Eyk]

Originally posted by Dan Stack
Why do you say that?

I meant that nowadays wars are no longer fought about territory like in the early 20th century and before, but wars are fought about resources no country is to give up easily.
If Kuwait would not have been a good oil supply, UN intervention would have taken far longer, like in Kosovo, where there is no oil.

[Evan van Eyk]

Originally posted by C5
And here is the problem. If we start chanting peace and love or make love not war, while some other beings are busily building an army, we are in great danger of being stamped upon.
OTOH, if we say that we have to keep a strong army because there are dangerous guys out there and so on, then this situation will never evolve and will be the same in some hundred years (only the weapons may evolve).
As always, the answer lies in the middle, but the middle is always hard to find.

Granted such steps require reason in a leader's mind, and not all in the world have this. Sadly

[calguard66]

Territory=Resources... whether it's actual material resources, trade access or what have you.

Wars are fought about the same things now that they always have been, and they are fought by peoples who have strong economic (and often social) ties, not by nations with nothing in common at all.

Civil wars are a marginal exception... even there the "resource" being fought over is power and control of a particular nation... and thereby it's resources.

Originally posted by Evan van Eyk
I meant that nowadays wars are no longer fought about territory like in the early 20th century and before, but wars are fought about resources no country is to give up easily.
If Kuwait would not have been a good oil supply, UN intervention would have taken far longer, like in Kosovo, where there is no oil.

[calguard66]

Leader nothing. It requires that average people be rational in the face of overwelming stress and emotion.

Good luck.

Originally posted by Evan van Eyk
Granted such steps require reason in a leader's mind, and not all in the world have this. Sadly