Whats wrong with Security?

[Dan Gurden]

After several months of trying to work with the plots it has occured to me that there is quite a common misconception about this under-used department...

It seems to me that many of us, as player or narrator seem to view security as Soldiers. Used for attack or defence... And as a Narrator I am constantly getting presented with what appears to be carbon copy characters of battle scarred veterans who are handy with a Phaser...

This has occured at the expense of a major part of Securities other roles...

Unfortunatly, this tends to leave the actual Law Enfoircement and Investigative aspects far behind.

As a player I can understand, after all I am not a trained law officer, and would only have rudimentary common sense investigative skills to apply to the character, but then as a narrattor I have exactly the same abilities to build the case to be investigated... So it should all work out equal in the end...

But I feel that a little more emphasis should be placed on the Law ENforcement side of Starfleet Security, rather than simply building carbon copy characters that are almost totally interchangeable 'point and shoot' characters!

Any ideas?

[Greg Davis]

Firstly, I'd like to say that I'm back from my short Christmas break, and that it did the trick, as I feel more stress-free than I have in some time...

As to the topic at hand, I'd have to agree with Dan here. I've only played a Security officer once, and he was more of an investigator than anything else, which I found was a lot of fun. Then again, most of the games I play in (no matter the setting or system) focus more on thinking and roleplaying, as opposed to heavy combat.

Now, this is not to say that there's anything wrong with games that are more combat-oriented, but it seems that more 'career-minded' or 'upwardly mobile' Security characters would be rounded to have the skills necessary to cover the wide aspects of the Security department. I mean, if all you really do is shoot good, then how would that character really ever move up the ranks, in my opinion? Sure, you can roleplay your way around a lack of certain social skills (in game terms), like leadership (or command), investigation and interrogation, as well as certain science skills that a Security officer might find useful, but I think that most Narrator's would want to see some game-related reflection of the skills and knowledge that the player is using for the character, thus necessitating the increase (or purchase) of certain skills for that sort of character.

I look at Worf as the primary example, here. Sure, he's primarily a combat-oriented character, but he also handles investigations, does interrogation, plus handles Tactical duties. He also seems to have a bit of science knowledge to help him out, too. To me, that's a good, well-rounded Security officer (and character).



Greg

[rasiler]

Originally posted by Greg Davis
I look at Worf as the primary example, here...

Actually, I was thinking more of Tuvok. I'm planning on presenting examples to my players of well-rounded characters in each field, as examples of the things to be thinking about for their characters. Like Odo, Tuvok is primarily a policeman and an investigator, but unlike Odo, also covers tactical and is damn fine with a phaser. That's not to say that Worf isn't a well-developed character, it's just that Tuvok is balanced a little differently, and a little more in the way that I'd like to run my campaign (ie more investigating and crime solving than shoot-em-up adventures).

Alan

[Sho-sa Kurita]

I would point to Tuvok as a better archetype as well. One of my favorite VOY eps (no bashing please) was the one with the black market for violent thoughts. Didn't need a phaser for that one.

It's a reflection on the writers, not Worf, but on the Enterprise-D, it often seemed the main duty of Security Chief was to yell "Intruder alert!" and dash off to apprehend. Tuvok was more liable to send his teams, implement force fields and then proceed to the scene. I also couldn't see Worf pulling off a long-term undercover mission like infiltrating the Maquis (I know a Klingon wouldn't get that job, but you know what I mean).

As for the law-enforcement side of things, I think that will always be backgrounded. On a starship it should very rarely be an issue. If you run a campaign on a SF-run starbase of some sort, maybe a little more. Another reason it's probably not used a lot is that most people feel they aren't good at coming up with and/or running mysteries, especially ones that don't require some Trek-techno-trick to solve, That kind of thing is harder to come up with in an RPG setting than on TV.

-- Daniel

[Owen E Oulton]

Actually, as a Security officer, I found Worf singularly unconvincing. As the old joke goes:
"I'm Captain Jean-Luc Picard, and this is my Security Chief, Lieutenant Worf. Would you like to beat him up?"
"Should I lose, Captain?"
Yes, Mr. Worf, badly."

Worf was best as a Tactical officer or on DS9 as Startegic Operation officer. I preferred Yar as Security, but if I were to pick an example of how to play Security, It'd be Odo.

Dunno why some folks are so sure that redshirts (or gold in TNG times) are soldiers, though. The vast majority of Security crewmembers are basic security guards - background spear-carriers, just like most of the engineering crew, or the lab technicians, but there should be plenty of role-playing possibilities for PC Security officers. In fact, a lot of the things other PCs do really should be handled by Security, like solving murder mysteries on ships and starbases (standard adventure).

[Lt.Khrys Antos]

Posted by Owen E.Oulton:

Dunno why some folks are so sure that redshirts (or gold in TNG times) are soldiers, though. The vast majority of Security crewmembers are basic security guards - background spear-carriers, just like most of the engineering crew, or the lab technicians, but there should be plenty of role-playing possibilities for PC Security officers. In fact, a lot of the things other PCs do really should be handled by Security, like solving murder mysteries on ships and starbases (standard adventure).

Redshirts aren't soldiers, their shields.

I've never played a security officer, but I had the same problem with my PC's. Every single security officer was assumed to be an ex-war veteran. I always assumed that security handles law enforcement duties, investigation and guard duties on ships. Once I explained to my players that security officers aren't soldiers, things went smoothly then.

From all the Trek series (excluding TOS), it always seemed that security personnel were the soldiers on a ship instead of the guards. Whenever someone boarded the ship, security would run around guns blazing.

[Perrryyy]

My opinion won't be much help here, because I don't play security officers, and pretty much for the reason that I view them as the one-dimensional, phaser-toting types we've seen on the shows (outside the aforementioned chiefs of security).

One idea I came up with (after the fact, gotta love when that happens), is the idea of a computer security type, the guy who;

makes sure all the computer codes are accurate, get changed when high ranking officers get kidnapped,

secure more delicate data from prying eyes of kids and visiting dignitaries who might not be what they seem

and I'm sure there are other things.


Apologies if that looks like a "don't know if this helps" or a "tangle", but it came to mind, oh, about a month ago while I was thinking about "what could have been" with a certain character.

[Perrryyy]

No sooner did I get through writing that post than another idea popped into my head. Don't ya hate that? (Note to my critics, 2 non-fluff posts from me within 5 minutes Nyah).

Most of the security officers/chiefs I've seen run in games almost automatically include Forensic science as part of their skill set (and rightly so, especially if the particular game has - oh, say an admiral lost in a transporter accident.) Now while the chief of security *could* collect all the forensic evidence himself (with the aid of his security grunts), I rather fancy the idea of a trained forensics expert attached to security. Sort of your Dr Quincy (aka coroner) on a starship. They'd work with both the medical staff and the security bunch to find and examine clues where murders/accidents occured in space.

[StyroFoam Man]

This message has been removed on request by the
poster

[Eric R.]

Ok I will be the trouble maker here,

I thought the reason there were no Starfleet marines was beause Starfleet Security could handle those nasty ground force duties.

Dan, I hope you realize that you layed out way exactly there is some form of ground force personnel in trek. If you constantly use your security force as ground troops eventually there true reason for being will slowly fade away and all your left with is burnt out ex-combat soldiers who could care less about law enforcement and only want to keep life a little easy after the Hell they have been through (especially in the Post Dominion era).

As a Side note Worf was originally proposed as a Starfleet Marine but GR shot that Idea down and made Worf a Security/Tactical officer instead. Unfortuantely Worf's basic character remained as a marine anyway.

[Lt Cmdr Matt]

I believe that a security officer would handle all of the following duties to protect the ship, or starlfeet interests: Tactical, Investigation, Interogation, Body Guard, Ground Forces, Policemen, pest control for all those nasty borg drones.... In general they do everything to ensure the safety of the crew. If that means grabbing a phaser and shooting then it does. If it means Interrogating to find the murderer than he/she does. All of that is protecting the well-being of Federation Citizens, among others.

If I offended anyone with this I am sorry and it was not done on purpose. I realize I may have been frank.

[Dan Gurden]

Originally posted by Eric R.
Dan, I hope you realize that you layed out way exactly there is some form of ground force personnel in trek. If you constantly use your security force as ground troops eventually there true reason for being will slowly fade away and all your left with is burnt out ex-combat soldiers who could care less about law enforcement and only want to keep life a little easy after the Hell they have been through (especially in the Post Dominion era).

Not at all. I have no problems with the dual function of security, in exactly the same way that I wrote the above posts without once thinking;

Y'know, what we really need is a clearly defined line between the Soldiers and Law Enforcement types...

In fact I believe I may have missed a point in saying that Starfleet Security should be able to function as both! I am firmly of the opinion that all Starfleet officers should be capable of multiple tasks rather than a focused job... So the extensive tactical training should focus their abilities as soldiers, just as their security training finly tune their deductive reasoning and investigative skills...

This rant has come up because of the Venture where I have an acting chief of security who both I and the player agree is not ready to work off the battlefield. Even though he is. And recent events have shown the deputy chief rather reticent to take part in an interrogation, leaving that to an Engineer/XO... Whereas I had set the scene up specifically to get Security involved outside of the 'point and shoot' category...

So far the security branch has relied completely on NPC's for anything outside of combat... And I was beginning to get concerned that this was the way of the future.

So, the fact is (IMO) that ALL Starfleet are able to function in multiple situations, and that combat training while a canon aspect of Starfleet academy life, is also (equally canon) a single part of all officer training with many other aspects involved...

For the record, I also have no problem with ground troops they are an aspect of Canon, I simply dislike 'Marines' and all the baggage that comes with them. In my world any Starfleet officer can become a soldier during a war, just as any soldier can get retrained out of the war...

To be equally honest/blunt, if I want soldiers in Trek... I'll drop them in as red-shirts thats their life expentancy when the phasers/disruptors start going off... When I run a game the players want to be the ones to stop this combat happening in the first place, combat is as deadly as it should be...

[First of Two]

Back when I played FASATrek, I had to make my security officer NPC a crack shot... because none of the Player's characters could shoot worth a damn.

[Eric R.]

Dan,
I understand what you are saying in that all starfleet officers should be capable of duel uses. However I feel that such a position is not in line with current trends of orgainziation in which officers are becoming ever more specialized, while training can make a good bridge officer able to read a readout and punch the right buttons to make a good science, security and/or tactical officer etc... would take more effort.

For instance imagine if in a modern police department called upon its officers to perform all of the same duties below at the same time:

S.W.A.T.
Anti Crime Officer
Undercover Agent
Patrol Officer
Dectective
Medical Examiner
Crime Prevention Duties
Bodyguard
Sniper
Negotiator/Counselor
and
Desk Sergeant/Precint Commander

Now let use add in the duties of a military officer with a knowledge of:

JAG
Small unit Tactics
Artillery/orbital support corrdination
Mechanized Tactics
Search and Seizure
Anti Boarding tactics
Boarding tactics
Starship tactics
Starbase/Planetary Defense Tactics
Weapon operations
Target aquisiation & Physics (both planetary and Stellar)

and still expect them to have some knowledge in the tactics of other nations/races!

I know I have been excessive in getting to my point, but to expect that a normal shipside Security officer to even have a passing knowledge of all this is asking alot. But then to expect them to interchange roles at will is simply guranteeing that no single job is performed at a minimal accepted standard. They would be near retirment before there training even got near to ending .

Simply put a normal Security officer would have knowledge of basic starship security procedures, basic invesigative skills, weapons knowledge and Anti boarding/boarding procedures. Thats it. Make your chracter with these concentration and you will end up with a normal appearing individual. The combat Type, what ever service they are in, will always veer toward the RRT, Ranger, Ground Force track of the profession. In addition I would suggest that instead of making the charcter the person in the know have a deep NPC collection of full time Security branch examiners, investigators and JAG officers that they can fall back on for advice and guidence. It would not be to far fetched to think that any starbase would have a full completment of these personnel present and ready for use.

With people specialized in certain areas and profession it forces people to act as a team and have to cooperate to succede. I mean think how many red shirts would still be alive in TV land if Kirk had just once turned and asked his securityu officer for some advice. The best scene of this is in the TOS epciode Devil in the Dark when he talked to to his Security Chief as a professional.

[Sea Tyger]

Originally posted by Dan Gurden
And recent events have shown the deputy chief rather reticent to take part in an interrogation, leaving that to an Engineer/XO... Whereas I had set the scene up specifically to get Security involved outside of the 'point and shoot' category...

Okay, I take some serious offense to that, Dan. I played my character the way he should have been played in that situation. The XO was handling the interrogation, and my character was a lowly Lt. j.g. Now, I may be "too military" for your game, but where I come from, if a senior officer (especially the XO) is doing the talking, then you sit back and be quiet. Period. Talking out of turn just doesn't happen in a military organization. That's how I played the character, because that's what I believed Bal should have done.

If you wanted security to do more than point and shoot, then maybe you should have had the captain order my character to interrogate the prisoner, instead of the XO....or maybe given us a private hint that the security guy was to conduct the interview. The way it looked to me was that the captain wanted the XO to conduct the interview...that meant I was there for insight and to make sure the Romulan played nice.