Nemesis "lowest-grossing Trek film EVER" ?

[REG]

Originally posted by prophetsteve

You don't release a scifi or fantasy movie anywhere near the releases of the megahits - LotR and Star Wars for sure unless (like Spiderman) you really know you can go toe-to-toe.

I agree. Usually it is best for the production company to release chick flick to cater the other part of the mainstream. Although there is an increase of female genre fans, the majority would prefer something more down-to-earth, like a Denzel Washington movie (he should've been Mace Windu).

[Phantom]

Originally posted by REG
...like a Denzel Washington movie (he should've been Mace Windu).

Have to disagree with you here. I perfer Jackson in the role.

[qerlin]

Originally posted by Phantom
Have to disagree with you here. I perfer Jackson in the role.

Yeah, but he doesn't call anybody "mutha f***a" in the role; jeesh...what's a burgeoning action dude supposed to do?

[prophetsteve]

Yeah, but he doesn't call anybody "mutha f***a" in the role; jeesh...what's a burgeoning action dude supposed to do?

But Denzel?

Jackson was fine - but if I could choose an alternate I would have gone for Wesley Snipes. If anything you would be sure that the martial arts and swords fights would be memorable.

[AslanC]

Mr. Lawrence Fishbourne

[Dan Stack]

Curious... Is Mace Windu's "blackness" essential to his character.

With the exception of Palpatine, Anakin, Padme, and Obi-Wan (who either appear in the original trilogy or whose kids do) I would think any of the human characters (i.e. Qui-Gon, Mace, etc.) could be of any skin color.

That said, I can't imagine anyone but Samuel Jackson as Mace - he brought so much enthusiasm to the role.

[AslanC]

No his "blackness" is not an issue, but it seems we are thinking of black actors who could have brought some, I dunno, acting ability to the role

No offense to the L Jackson fan club, but I have seen this guy play exactly one character throughout his career, Samuel L Jackson.

Much like Ben Affleck, I don't consider this guy an actor, he is a movie star.

[AslanC]

But back on topic.

Since Nemesis is having the worst box office ever, does anyone think the studio will put money into another movie?

[Phantom]

AS long as the cost of making the movie is covered, sure they will. And it probably will...Since they don't seem to put too much of the budget into the actual story.

At least STV tried to ask some philisophical questions, the only question I was thinking about during the this movie was should I spend the money on a drink re-fill.

[REG]

Originally posted by Phantom

Have to disagree with you here. I perfer Jackson in the role.

Michael Jackson? Eww, you're a freak! LOL!

P.S. Nah, couldn't see Samuel Jackson as a romantic figure, unless he's doing a Shaft sequel. Denzel Washington, Laurence Fishburne (now married to Gina Torres who plays Zoe on Firefly), Will Smith, Tyrese ... now those guys are romantic figures.

Um, let's forget about having this awkward conversation, okay?

[REG]

Originally posted by AslanC
But back on topic.

Since Nemesis is having the worst box office ever, does anyone think the studio will put money into another movie?

I honestly don't know. I thought they could bank on this movie because they got THE screenwriter of the Academy Award-winning movie Gladiator, John Logan, who claims to be a Trek fan.

What is Nicholas Meyer (director and screenwriter of The Wrath of Khan and The Undiscovered Country) doing these days?

[Weyoun12]

I thought if Nemesis was truly indeed, as advertised " the FINAL journey" of the TNG crew it could have been a better movie. The formula used in the movie reminded me of Insurrection despite the stuff Logan wrote. This was a movie more about Picard senior versus junior self with a "death in the family" (or is it really? ie: B-4) sidenote. The rest of Nemesis was stuff we've seen before and done much better like the First Contact and TWOK spacebattles and the death of Spock in TWOK. The Romulans were barely a factor in this one. Fans want to see more species they are familiar with than the "creative" stuff B&B spew forth. I hope if they get another WWE superstar to do a spot on " Enterprise" let's say, I pray its Stone Cold Steve Austin so he can "stunner", pun intended, Berman and Braga to oblivion. I am biased here obviously but Trek's glory days IMHO peaked at the end of DS9 and got down right silly in the later seasons of Voyager and has sunk since. Enterprise isn't all that bad but the mirror of Voyager overshadows it somehow even if it just boils down to Jolene Blalock being a Jeri Ryan clone.

[prophetsteve]

I honestly don't know. I thought they could bank on this movie because they got THE screenwriter of the Academy Award-winning movie Gladiator, John Logan, who claims to be a Trek fan.

The whole idea of another Wrath of Khan type movie (Starfleet Captain vs. Evil Megalomaniac #74) was probably not the best choice.

I haven't seen Nemesis yet from all the trailers and clops I have seen it feels like Paramount was screaming to Logan "The fans love Wrath of Khan. Give us a movie like Wrath of Khan". Big evil megalomaniac vs. Intrepid Captain. Big Space Battle. Sacrifice by Beloved member of the crew. Enterprise gets a good licking in the process. Sounds like Wrath of Khan to me, although the details have been altered to protect the innocent.

Maybe we need a writer that isn't a Trek fan to be paired with a Trek fan. Have the non-trek writer make the plot and the trek writer fit it into continuity and make it feel like Trek. We need an influx of new blood and new ideas.

Remember that Meyer wasn't a Trek fan - I am watching the STII Special Edition DVD and its amazing how these people (director, art people, special effects) looked at Trek and the movie itself. These guys were sci-fi fans but not necessarily "Trek" fans. The changes they made to Trek (uniforms, etc) shaped modern era Trek and for the better.

Maybe what Trek needs is just some "new blood" under controlled circumstances. Sort of like what happened in STII.

[REG]

IIRC, NEMESIS director Stuart Baird is not a Trek fan, nor have he followed the Trek lore.

BTW, if you're going to give something like the Wrath of Khan, make it believable. I am still confused as to how the Reman took control of the Romulan government, and there is no civil war. I mean if it were that easy, the Federation could have done it (if the Federation don't mind invading in order to make the Romulan into a Federation society).

[erhershman]

I've seen Nemesis only once and TTT three times, but that certainly doesn't mean I don't like Nemesis.

I'd like to know what IDIOT came up with the idea of releasing Nemesis a week before The Two Towers... what a MORON. Here was have at least one mistake on Trek that wasn't made by Rick Berman!

Nemesis would be doing fine if they had released it about two months ago.

And you have to remember... those numbers are based on HOW MUCH MONEY it is making, not how many people actually liked it. The response to Nemesis in our area was very positive... they all liked it. Actually the only Trek fans I have seen who have not liked Nemesis are on these boards, no offense. I'm not going to start off this issue again, but a lot of people don't understand what it is REALLY about. It is NOT about an insane villain who wants to destroy the Earth with his gigantic radiation-weapon. It is about Picard and his struggle with deciding whether Shinzon's actions can truly be justified by any means, or whether he is TRULY evil... and whether Picard himself would be capable of the same thing. A lot of people don't like the introduction of another Soong-type android... this is because I don' t think they understand that Data's story is meant to parallel Picard's; while Picard struggles to differentiate himself from Shinzon, Data struggles to distinguish his own identity from the B-4. It's a classic parallel plot, in my opinion.

The core of this movie is summed up in the scene with Picard and Data in Astrometrics or Stellar Cartography or wherever it was:

Picard: How can you be sure?

Data: Because I aspire, sir. To be more than I am. The B-4 does not... nor does Shinzon.

THAT is what Nemesis is really about. A lot of people think this movie is a copycat of TWOK... they are mistaken I think because Kirk does not have such a complex psychological thing with Khan. Certainly there are parallels between the two movies, but I totally disagree with the idea that John Logan simply "copied" another Trek movie. And even if he did... if there wasn't SOMETHING familiar about Nemesis, it wouldn't be Star Trek, now would it?