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Thread: 22nd Century Technology

  1. #1
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    Post 22nd Century Technology

    I'm working on a set of plans for the Daedalus-class Explorer. I've made the discovery you'd have to be very brave to go out in one of those...

    I've been making certain assumptions about the level of technology in the 2160's. In some areas I can't find any evidence. Below are some of my assumptions. Opinions welcome.

    Phasers - None.

    Photon Torpedoes - None, assume that the torps listed in the LUG Core rules reflect a later upgrade.

    Subspace Radio - It exists (the Romulan Neutral Zone was negotiated with it) but the equipment is too large to carry on a ship.

    Artificial Gravity - Available.

    Deflector Shields - Available.

    FTL Sensors - Available (otherwise they wouldn't be able to navigate at warp speed)

    Food - According to the TOS Core Rules, the Daedalus served up a yummy goo.

    Material Fabricators - This is where I'm drawing a blank. This basically gives the ship a mini-factory. Not as powerful as a 24th century replicator, it would allow the ship to go out without needing an incredible amount of cargo. I can't see how such a small ship would survive without one. But my instinct tells me it is too advanced for the 22nd century.

    Shuttles - Needed, given no transporters. I do wonder what they'd look like. Would they be blocky/non-aerodynamic like most Star Trek shuttles? It'd certainly allow more to squeeze into the small shuttlebay.

    Crew Quarters - Captain gets his own stateroom. Most officers double up. Enlisted berthed in bunkrooms.

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  2. #2

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    Sounds good.

    For weapons, I think that they would have a mix of nuclear and conventional missiles, and laser batteries... Didn't they have lasers in TOS "The Menagerie"?

    Unless there is canon evidence otherwise, I think subspace radio would be a must-have.

  3. #3
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    Pretty certain they had lasers. I would assume, as per Mig, they have a wealth of missile-like nasties.

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    Regarding subspace radio, there is canon evidence (TOS: "A Piece of the Action") that ships had only conventional radio.

    I don't view the Daedalus as much of a warship. She's fairly cramped as it is - I see a laser battery on the bottom of the primary hull and some missile launchers in the engineering hull. Much more and the crew will be sleeping in the torpedo room (which I know is indeed done in the US Navy... )

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    Regarding subspace radio, there is canon evidence (TOS: "A Piece of the Action") that ships had only conventional radio.

    I don't view the Daedalus as much of a warship. She's fairly cramped as it is - I see a laser battery on the bottom of the primary hull and some missile launchers in the engineering hull. Much more and the crew will be sleeping in the torpedo room (which I know is indeed done in the US Navy... )

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    Thanks for the clarification on the comms

  7. #7
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    Lightbulb

    Hi Dan!

    For the last two weeks I've been trying to come up with technical details for ships at the beginning of the Federation. There isn't very much to go on! I thought I'd share some of my assumptions / opinions on this subject as well. The FASA game system had a supplement on the Romulan war. Although it is not canon, I have found some of their explanations about the technology at the time to be very useful. Some of what I will suggest has come from that resource.

    I really see these ships as being very primitive compared to TOS-TNG-DS9-VGR ships. That's why I like them. Our players must really role-play and not depend so much on their technology.

    The main beam weapons are lasers. I think that they may have used a weaker form of lasers called particle beams. They should probably have a much smaller range than modern lasers and phasers. There accuracy should be much less as well. This could compensate for the more powerful lasers that were used against the Klingons later on. I think the first two lasers in the Spacedock supplement could bee seen as these kinds of lasers.

    I agree that most ships of the time used rocket / missiles as their main missile weapons. However, I think that it is not too much of a stretch for the Federation to have just begun implementing an early version of the photon torpedo. These nuclear / fusion / (whatever?) torpedoes would need to have a very limited range and would not be guided. They should no be capable of firing a spread. There destructive power might even be a little less than some of the other missiles / rockets used by other star faring races (like the Romulans) at the time. However, there accuracy and speed should be much greater than that of the chemically propelled missiles / rockets. In other words, as the chemical rockets travel below the speed of light, we might say that the early photon torpedoes may be able to travel at warp 1 for a very short distance. This would make them very useful, if not as powerful as other missile weapons.

    I haven't got to watch the First Contact movie again to see what powers the first human warp ship, but I think there needs to be a precursor to the modern dilithium-powered ships (Especially since dilithium doesn't exist on earth! Yes, I do know that it is make-believe!). These early warp engines would not be nearly as efficient or as powerful as current warp drives. FASA assumed that these early warp engines used a form of "lithium" crystals to channel power through. I think some concept like this can give us the reason we need to have ships with warp drives that generate much lower levels of power than the more current ships. This might also be way of explaining why these early ships can only go to a certain warp speed and no higher. I think warp 3.5 is fast enough for the emergency speed of the Daedalus Class explorer. Older ships should have to go even slower.

    I have some other ideas too, but I’ve rambled on to much.


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    "Kirk to Enterprise. Cestus III has been destroyed." (Oh, like who doesn't scan a planet before they beam down?

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    A good (non-canon) source on pre-TOS technology can be found at the Starfleet Museum at: http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/sfmuseum/index.htm

    I've been using that as an aid to my Daedalus deckplans. The more I work on them, the braver I think you'd have to be to go on one...

    I do agree, it would be a neat time period for a campaign. If I finish the plans, I'll submit them to trekrpg.net. It's looking good - I have rough plans for five out of the eight primary hull decks so far. Doing a heck of a lot better than my aborted Defiant-plans!

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    No PHASERS but LASERS, the biggest laser perhaps doing what a Type 3-5 phaser could do?

    Photon Torpedoes? Not til 23 rd century (can't remember exact date, think STFF has it). They instead have Atomic missiles (nukes). Good range and damage, the primary weapon of the day.

    Subspace radio? Only on later models of this class. Why existing in this time it was big, blocky and extremely limited in range.

    Artificial gravity? Probably not had it for long, perhaps from the Vulcans?

    Shields? Yes most definately, crap compared to today's ships but could probably take 2 atomics and just survive. ie some damage and no shields.

    FTL sensors? But of course, even the Cochrane's phoenix would have had the rudimentry design.

    Food? By the cargo bay full!

    Material Fabricators? Perhaps, the original Enterprise had things like this but no organic and certainly not very energy efficient. Use at your discretion and in emergency. Basically a poor man's industrial replicator.

    Shuttles? Sleek, I could see a lot of atmospheric landings with no transporter till app. 2205

    Quarters? Only the best for the cpt and some bunking for officers.


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    SIR SIG a Aussie TREK Narrator

  10. #10
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    A few notes on Sir Sig's comments...

    Type 3 Phaser? That's a rifle... On the other tentacle, it's a damned powerful rifle, so perhaps its about right for a starship laser in power.

    Artificial Gravity - They definitely had it. Earth had artificial gravity as early as 1996. If you don't believe me, check out Space Seed.

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    One thing I'm running into is a difficulty to not make it too primitive. It's a problem found in TOS games as well, as modern (i.e. 2001) technology has in many ways eclipsed what was seen on TOS, unless you go with the "classic 23rd century retro-look" theory, but even with that there is an unconscious desire to make it more primitive.

    For example, take the yummy nutrient paste the TOS Core book ascribes to the Daeadlus-class. I'm not sure why it would do that. We have the technology to store food for a long, long time today. Not going to be as good as fresh strawberries, but it's got to be better than nutrient paste. I can't picture going on a five-year (or one-year) mission eating nothing but nutrient paste. Good thing they had no Prime Directive - the second they had shore leave they must have sprinted to the nearest tavern on the nearest pre-starfaring world and exchanged technological trinkets in return for food and drink other than the nutrient paste...

    Sorry... Moving on to fabricators. Right now we have the ability to imagine building tiny robot factories. Could we do it with today's technology? No, but I don't believe (I could be wrong) that it requires a quantum leap in technology, at least compared to the replicator or transporter. Which is why I'm giving serious thought to giving the Daedalus some sort of fabrication and recycling equipment. Not the best or fastest. (Hmm, maybe the fabricators can make food, but only in the form of yummy nutrient paste...) But I am trying to find some proof that they did not have such a technology before I plop it on...

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  12. #12
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    Originally posted by Owen E Oulton:
    A few notes on Sir Sig's comments...

    Type 3 Phaser? That's a rifle... On the other tentacle, it's a damned powerful rifle, so perhaps its about right for a starship laser in power.

    Artificial Gravity - They definitely had it. Earth had artificial gravity as early as 1996. If you don't believe me, check out Space Seed.
    There ya go again Owen

    I had meant type 3 ship Phasers but perhaps laser really are that powerful.

    As to artificial gravity, I was meaning the Trek type of a gravity generator in the floor and not a rotating section of the ship to provide artificial gravity which I believe you assumed unless we really do have gravity generators now. If thats the case ignore!



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    SIR SIG a Aussie TREK Narrator

  13. #13
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    What I mean is that in the alternate universe in which Khan Noonian Singh stole a sleeper ship in 1996, they had genuine (i.e. not spin-induced) artificial gravity. Kirk and company have absolutely no problem walking around on the 1990's-era SS Botany Bay. Ergo, Trek-Earth had developed artificial gravity - or Henry Starling had reverse-engineered it from the Aeon and Chronowerx supplied units to NASA (or whoever it was that built the Botany Bay...

  14. #14
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    Regarding artificial gravity, that's definitely there. If for no other reason than the fact that I still have headaches figuring out coriolis effects from Babylon 5 ships...

    Seriously though, given the incredible speeds and accelerations (including sublight ones) Star Trek ships endure, inertial dampeners would be a must and from there artificial gravity would be easy.

    As a side note, do you know how much room all those lifeboats take? (8 of 9 Primary Hull decks roughly done)

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    That's "inertial dampers," not "dampeners." You want to reduce the effects of inertia, not get it wet!

    But yes, you're correct, a faster than light drive means having an inertial damper, which in turn means artificial gravity. Note also that gravity control also means you'll have tractor beams, albeit simple brute-force ones with little in the way of finesse.

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