[News] Decipher RPG Product Lines Transferred

[StyroFoam Man]

This message has been removed on request by the
poster

[Balok]

Or you can be an ICON drone and wait for ... "The Game That Also Isn't Coming"...

See, both games are in the same state: everything official that will be published has been published. Neither one is superior on that basis.

It comes down to personal preference -- or the recognition that CODA was designed by most of the same folks who produced ICON, and who took the opportunity to correct its flaws...

[D.S.McBride]

The term "correct it's [meaning Icon's] flaws" is a pretty subjective one. No, it's not a perfect game engine; no, it's not being produced anymore (with the exception of Steve Long's final Spacedock sourcebook); yes, the Drama Die can lead to some wonky and inappropriate results on occasion. Nonetheless, after a three-session tryout with Coda, our group concluded that, "It just doesn't feel like Star Trek", and we gratefully went back to Icon.

"Recognition" is in the eye of the beholder. We've resigned ourselves to the fact that, for at least the forseeable future, it's Coda from here on out, but it would be nice to at least get something handed to us rather than empty promises, and a company administration that just doesn't seem to give a ripe damn. LUG, whatever its flaws, definitely did not fall into the same category as Decipher when it came to broken promises for delivery dates and brushing the consumer off like a half-bright horsefly. A small difference, maybe, but a crucial one when it comes to me and my gaming group.

[Space_Cadet]

Its hard to believe that a company would end their line when they already or seems to have the layout done. Someone posted the cover for Mirror Book

http://s88437467.onlinehome.us/trekbooks.jpg

[tonyg]

Originally posted by Space_Cadet
Its hard to believe that a company would end their line when they already or seems to have the layout done.

Actually, it is quite common in the RPG business. It costs a lot more money to print off the book than it does th pay people to write it. And the the book has to be stored, shipped, advertised, etc.

That why there are copies games and supplements out there that were never published.

It also one of the reasons why many RPG companies have gone belly up, or switched to making thier books availble on-line in pdf format.

LUG had several supplements for thier TREK RPG in various stages of completion, includng a few that were ready for printing when they were bought by WoTC.

[koraldon]

I think you are wrong - If you will look at rpg.net forums, at some of the "why RPG's so expansive?" you will see some sample cost break-downs that show that printing, while expansive, is less costly then production.

[tonyg]

Originally posted by koraldon
I think you are wrong - If you will look at rpg.net forums, at some of the "why RPG's so expansive?" you will see some sample cost break-downs that show that printing, while expansive, is less costly then production.

It isn't just a question of what is the most expensive aspect of producing an RPG, just some of the reasons why an RPG product that ready to be printed doesn'gt get printed.

If the company has a change or heart, and doesn't believe in a product line, or if the product isn't generating the amount of revenue they wished, printing something can be viewed as throwing good money after bad.

Many RPG companies are really little more than hobbies run out of someone's garage, and are running on a shoestring budget. By the time a project is ready to be printed, the money might exhausted. Few people get into writing RPGs for the money-it's a labor of love.

Also, if a company wants to take a "wait and see" approach to a product line, holding off on printing allows them time to see how the line picks up. If it takes off the other supplements can always be printed later.

On the other hand, once a deal has been made with the printer, it costs money even if the company decides to cancel the print run. THere are actuallysome game supplements that managed to get printed simply becuase the company had to pay the printer anyway, so the might as well got something in return.

[REG]

No wonder e-book (or PDF) publishing seems to be the more economic choice for small print presses, despite the fact that it will take a long time before you can pay off the cost of the software needed for electronic desktop publishing. But at least there is no deadline nor appointment with the printing company.

What's more, you can offer errata "patch" to fix your work.

Of course, after such a e-book product is released, a publishinghouse may want to offer you to make print version to be sold at FLGS (where a guy like me with no plastic can make acquisitions).

But tonyg is right. Whether or not printing is expensive, it is the last stage of developing a final print product, and some of the time, money can run out right before that. And you have no choice but to reach deep into your pocket, wait until revenue is picking up, or delay other book projects to re-shuffle the budget.

[Ezri's Toy]

Originally posted by REG
No wonder e-book (or PDF) publishing seems to be the more economic choice for small print presses, despite the fact that it will take a long time before you can pay off the cost of the software needed for electronic desktop publishing. But at least there is no deadline nor appointment with the printing company.

Assuming the purchase of pro-level software and that Macintoshes are graphic-design-industry-standard, you can buy the hardware and software for one single-license DTP station for less than $4000. . . . which is equal to or less than one good-sized print production run.

Of course, just because you have the tools, it doesn't necessarily mean that your results will be professional. . . .

[Don Mappin]

Originally posted by Ezri's Toy
What does this mean for the future of Trek-RPG.net, Don ?

Still TBD at this time.

[D.S.McBride]

This probably belongs on the other sticky - and I've written it before - but here's hoping that the site continues under present management.

While it may be a bit ahead of schedule, Don, sincere congratulations on the InQuest Gamers award. Much deserved, I have no doubt.

[D.S.McBride]

Doing some late-night cruising on RPG.net - the thread, in fact, that Don's linked on his Abulia Savant site - and came across this very interesting revelation from an ex-LUG/Decipher employee of our acquaintance:

Originally posted by George Vasilakos on RPG.net
We made a great game from a licensed property because the employees at Eden cared for what they were doing and cared for how important the games release was for the company.

As a previous employee of Decipher, who did the graphics end of the LoTR and Trek corebooks, I was their and was part of it all.

Basically the division was horribly mismanaged.

Decipher Prime didnt give the RPG division the comtrol to do things without Decipher Prime intervention.

One of the major reasons I left was that I was hired to do the graphics and art design. It was design by committee with Decipher Prime and you would have the CCG marketing people making comments and changes to our stuff.

The LUG crew knew what they were doing but had many hurdles set in front of them by Decipher Prime. But the other problem was no one cared. We were all being paid good money to do our job but no one went the extra mile since we were employees for a company that didnt seem to care at times. So since no one had a personal interest in the company - why should they work that extra bit to make sure things get done?

The RPG division had a lot of potential. It produced some good stuff while it was their but it could have done better if the correct people were in charge.

I hope that Mr. Vasilakos doesn't mind my quoting his writing from another site, but I feel that this gives a good bit of insight into the workings - or lack thereof - at Decipher and exactly what made the current horrorshow a matter of when rather than if.

[REG]

I don't know if I could believe Mr. Vasilakos's statement above.

But I can't help but have this one lingering question for "Decipher Prime": Why get into the RPG business in the first place?

Maybe they had good intentions in the beginning, but if it is true, then "Decipher Prime" committed a sin more horrible than what Braga could conjure.

"And the bash goes on...
And the bash goes on..."

[Balok]

It's probably worth pointing out that you're generally not going to get an unbiased view from someone who left a company. Even if they try really hard to be objective, the fact remains that they left because they were unhappy. They're not likely to have kind things to say about previous bosses. And they might be right. Or they might be bitter.

I don't know Mr. Vasilakos at all, so I can't comment on his state of mind. But I do know many people who have discussed former employers, and certain patterns are usually there...

[Don Mappin]

George is a stand up guy. Believe him or not but he's a class act.